ARmy Rumour SErvice

So I have to rely on people who've been there and done that to learn about the soldiering aspects of any inventions I come up with, or any other aspects other than the technical which is my strength. We may not agree on everything but we are on the same side. Perhaps something for you to keep in mind before you add more scorn to your posts.

And actually, I didn't say something else but I think it's worth it. Scorn?

And, please don't be all arrogant and look down on me because I was not able to join the Army

I said:

Stick to Call of Duty or wherever you get your tactical advice mate.

I didn't draw any conclusion about service or lackthereof. Given I have no idea who you are, how would I know that? or even would care about it. Plenty of regular and territorials seem to exist on a diet of "Call of Duty" or whatever else is on the Sony day wasting device. You seem to have a problem about it, however. The real crux of it for me is this; So you've gone to the bother of reading Brevik's tiresome manifesto and gotten yourself all worried about people posing as blue light responders. A quite fair point, to my twisted, bitter, and harsh mind at least, is;

Well maybe you should have paid attention during the coppers' visit to school, looked at the posters outside police stations or just popped into your local nick and asked to see what a warrant card looked like.

And your response?

Like most law abiding citizens I don't expect to be shown one and therefore couldn't be bothered to know what it looks like.

Er? well You've doomed yourself there then, haven't you? Crikey, no one's going to kill you at a nick for asking that quite reasonable question. There's enough community outreach and all that isn't there? Unless you live in the Northern Constabulary area or something (don't answer that, don't want any idea where you live mate-but you get the point?). I would rather the public did know what a warrant card looks like (I agree with you, Bigeye), but strangely I don't think we've time to nip around everyone's house (unless I'm kicking the door in or nipping around to tell you a loved one is dead). The public do have to do a bit in this social contract! Like the next bit though (genuinely)! "We'll make a soldier of you yet, Hook" (Zulu, finest war movie made!)

I still maintain if someone Photoshopped one, had a police uniform on and acted imperious, arrogant and rude, it would fool most people they were talking to a copper. And if in an apparent bad mood, most people will not want to get in the way.

Seriously though, credit where credit is due; well done on the engineering degree, good hard subject. No idea why you bring it up, but anyway, good effort.

What's this? 'johnny come latelys' turning up and abusing established members... not only that they are plod!

yeah, don't worry the Home Office have got a plan for an internet filter to wipe out porn and bitter, smart arses! It's gonna be great! Anyway, back to thrashing the plod! (As Max Mosely once said, allegedly)

C09, bless them (and I knew a few who worked at Walton Street) are gate guards basically

Is CO9 the new name for Diplomatic Protection Group (otherwise known as 'Doors, Porches and Gates'?) I've heard some hysterically funny stories about them, from other DPG officers who are alarmed at some of their brethern who they cannot get rid of!) I did raise an eyebrow at that bloke blatting off a few rounds at Mark Saunders. I sent a mate on DPG a few texts saying "You are that man, and I claim my £5. Shooting at a barrister was too tempting, wasn't it?" It is said (probably by the biased) that DPG is the drip-tray for SO19 wash-outs. How true that is, I don't know. Probably a bit of capbadge bashing. Though I must mention the DPG bloke I saw who had moulded his cap to look like some Hauptman off the Leibstandarte. Cracking sense of humour on a fixed point, mind you I am pretty warped. I never saw if he had tattoos....

Originally Posted by Boumer

some Hauptman off the Leibstandarte.

Don't you mean Hauptsturmführer? Hauptmann was a Wehrmacht rank.

Originally Posted by Screw_The_Nut

I'm at a loss to work out how you might be "effecting or assisting in the lawful arrest of offenders" whilst doing a Beirut unload with your MP5. Protecting yours/someone else's life is, of course, a totally different story.

Sorry, I must have not put it properly.

You've hit the point I was trying to make exactly!

Police use of force comes from the section I quoted, s117 of PACE (basically reasonable force to exercise powers under PACE-search, arrest, entry that sort of thing) and the common law right to self defence that we all apparently enjoy. There may be internal policies, but that law is the bit that your are judged on should you debe compelled to use to use lethal force

That's why I don't approve of this "militarised" approach to policing which this thread is about;

Firstly, it directly goes against what the British police are supposed to be. Non-military and subject to the criminal law; and

Secondly, (and cynically) officers doing that sort of thing will find themselves up in court in the unlikely event the senior ranks actually enable a prosecution of SFO's.

(However, as I also cynically put, I don't think the seniors will allow an SFO to be prosecuted except in the most indefensible of circumstances).

Originally Posted by Boumer

And actually, I didn't say something else but I think it's worth it. Scorn? I said: I didn't draw any conclusion about service or lackthereof. Given I have no idea who you are, how would I know that? or even would care about it. Plenty of regular and territorials seem to exist on a diet of "Call of Duty" or whatever else is on the Sony day wasting device. You seem to have a problem about it, however. The real crux of it for me is this; So you've gone to the bother of reading Brevik's tiresome manifesto and gotten yourself all worried about people posing as blue light responders. A quite fair point, to my twisted, bitter, and harsh mind at least, is; And your response? Er? well You've doomed yourself there then, haven't you? Crikey, no one's going to kill you at a nick for asking that quite reasonable question. There's enough community outreach and all that isn't there? Unless you live in the Northern Constabulary area or something (don't answer that, don't want any idea where you live mate-but you get the point?). I would rather the public did know what a warrant card looks like (I agree with you, Bigeye), but strangely I don't think we've time to nip around everyone's house (unless I'm kicking the door in or nipping around to tell you a loved one is dead). The public do have to do a bit in this social contract! Like the next bit though (genuinely)! "We'll make a soldier of you yet, Hook" (Zulu, finest war movie made!) Seriously though, credit where credit is due; well done on the engineering degree, good hard subject. No idea why you bring it up, but anyway, good effort. yeah, don't worry the Home Office have got a plan for an internet filter to wipe out porn and bitter, smart arses! It's gonna be great! Anyway, back to thrashing the plod! (As Max Mosely once said, allegedly) Is CO9 the new name for Diplomatic Protection Group (otherwise known as 'Doors, Porches and Gates'?) I've heard some hysterically funny stories about them, from other DPG officers who are alarmed at some of their brethern who they cannot get rid of!) I did raise an eyebrow at that bloke blatting off a few rounds at Mark Saunders. I sent a mate on DPG a few texts saying "You are that man, and I claim my £5. Shooting at a barrister was too tempting, wasn't it?" It is said (probably by the biased) that DPG is the drip-tray for SO19 wash-outs. How true that is, I don't know. Probably a bit of capbadge bashing. Though I must mention the DPG bloke I saw who had moulded his cap to look like some Hauptman off the Leibstandarte. Cracking sense of humour on a fixed point, mind you I am pretty warped. I never saw if he had tattoos....

Actually I've got my Special and Central operations mixed up. The DPG is actually S06 - I'm not sure where the C09 came from - my fevered imagination I suppose.

Just some views on warrant cards. In general they will have a photo, say Police Officer, a crest of the Force, Warrant Number etc. However, they don't all look the same:

Often found in something like this:


Often have brail thereon, sometimes in brail on the back:


No wonder Sooty gave Sweep such a hard time:

Originally Posted by chocolate_frog

The 'I ran out of rounds' comment came from the Irranian Embassy siege...

Date of Private Eye in question is 1988, you do the math.

I recall that 25 or so years ago, a local mong who claimed to be head of 'Her Majesty's Special Security Service' got past three layers of security and made his way on to the Royal train (which was parked up whilst Prince Charles kipped in the sleeping carriage) using a home-made ID card. He had a pocketful of marijuana and when apprehended said he wanted to discuss architecture with HRH, and took the drugs so as not to ungraciously 'tap the Royal stash.'

Originally Posted by bokkatankie

Date of Private Eye in question is 1988, you do the math.

priavte Eye isn't really noted for its non satirical take on the events in question. Google it, there is no outrage at such a statment being made in the inquest. Which due to the 'delicate' nature of the 'number of rounds fired' would have caused outrage.