TATTT; total waste of MTDs / time?

**Bravo_Bravo** · 06-09-2010, 23:14

Don't get me wrong, I thought the course was excellent and the DS superb, BUT... how relevant is it to TA SUT Instructors?

We don't teach, we deliver lessons which is not the same thing. A formalised lesson plan is supposed to be followed; its even usually scripted. So, little interaction unless you are Cadre staff; which means little use for the package for most DS.

Thoughts?

BB

**RP578** · 06-09-2010, 23:28

B_B,

I think the coaching aspect could be useful at certain times back at unit whilst working in the Recruit Wing and not so much at an RTC. Even then I guess you wouldn't really trot out the GROW model on all your SUTs, but I can see how it could help some of those that consistently display numerous "areas of opportunity". I got to say, it does help in my day job! The CTLLS qual was an unexpected bonus too.

**tiggrsown** · 07-09-2010, 09:04

BB You should be using the coaching techniques even in the basic lessons - its not about reading the script/powerpoints its about truly engaging with the learners and adjusting your style so that we train in, making it interesting (I've even seen Who wants to be a millionaire CBRN! and the SuTs loved it), inclusive etc etc

**Boxy** · 07-09-2010, 10:26

I agree with Tiggr, the coaching aspect is in almost constant use, ok so there are some scripted stuff e.g. Theory of a group even then you can engage with the SuT.I have used the GROW model on occasion, then again we don't deal with nearly as many SuT as other RTCs so the time is easier to find.....

**fallingplate** · 10-09-2010, 08:51

It’s all down to imagination, working within the parameters of the lesson plan, but coming up with ingenious ways to make it interesting and meet the individuals learning needs.

So were you a 'protestor' a 'passenger' or an enthusiast on the course?

**Boxy** · 10-09-2010, 10:00

TBH I started as a protester and finished an enthusiast.

**Carlos_Hathcock_II** · 13-09-2010, 10:35

Originally Posted by fallingplate

So were you a 'protestor' a 'passenger' or an enthusiast on the course?

I did the 6 day jobbie, and I think I was all three at times.

What really gripped my shit was the name change from Recruit to SuT.

Even now I think 'WTF????!!!!'
I know the pat answers, but no one was able to give me an answer that I though..'Oh yeah, right! Good idea.' Instead I thought - 'You think its pump too!'

**Boxy** · 13-09-2010, 22:24

Originally Posted by Carlos_Hathcock_II

...What really gripped my shit was the name change from Recruit to SuT.

Even now I think 'WTF????!!!!'
I know the pat answers, but no one was able to give me an answer that I though..'Oh yeah, right! Good idea.' Instead I thought - 'You think its pump too!'

What he said!

**sapperboy** · 15-09-2010, 22:25

Originally Posted by Boxy

What he said!

Its simples, one a recruit has been recruited, he or she is no longer a recruit 'cos they have started training....but they are not a trained soldier yet, so, they must be Soldiers under Training - SuT. Simples....

**msr** · 15-09-2010, 22:35

or a pointless re-defining of an already accepted word?

Recruit until trained soldier has worked for several hundred years without fail. Until some no-mark SO2 decided to put his oar in.

For evidence see Camp=Annual Exercise, SPSI= PSI(T), PFT=BPFA, CFT=AFT, SL=LoD, Drill Nights=Training Nights etc, ad nauseam.

It's the invisible "planned and implemented change" box which only seems to be on regular OJARS...

MSR

**sapperboy** · 15-09-2010, 22:42

I know who changed the name and he is not an SO2, or SO1 for that matter.
Comments like that will cause you see stars!

**msr** · 15-09-2010, 23:04

Originally Posted by sapperboy

I know who changed the name and he is not an SO2, or SO1 for that matter.
Comments like that will cause you see stars!

Wow, MSR as a 1*

winner

Whoever thought this was a clever change is a f**kwit and I will say that to his / her face and it will give me greater satisfaction if they are part of Recruiting Group - who have a new name now and I rest my case.

MSR

**Boxy** · 15-09-2010, 23:05

Originally Posted by sapperboy

Its simples, one a recruit has been recruited, he or she is no longer a recruit 'cos they have started training....but they are not a trained soldier yet, so, they must be Soldiers under Training - SuT. Simples....

I know all that, I have defended all that, I've explained all that to others, I still think it's pump, cos trained soldiers can be considered SuT when they are on a course or undergoing any form of training unless of course they are to be called TSuT?

**msr** · 15-09-2010, 23:06

It is stupid and pointless and we need to call it as such.

**RP578** · 15-09-2010, 23:35

Originally Posted by sapperboy

Its simples, one a recruit has been recruited, he or she is no longer a recruit 'cos they have started training

This is not true. A Recruit does not cease to to be a Recruit once he/she has been recruited. If that were the case, when exactly would they have been a Recruit? It couldn't have been before they were recruited as they were then Potential Recruits.

Nor is it true that a Recruit has started training once recruited. The lag time between Attestation and Phase 1 can be months in some cases. The term SuT (as I understand it and I am prepared to be corrected) was introduced as an administrative term to distinguish between those Recruits who were waiting to start Phase 1 and those who had already commenced training. It seems to have gained greater currency since then.

There was a similar issue about 5 years ago in Regular training establishments vis-a-vis the lag time between Phase 1 and Phase 2 Trade Training. Those waiting for the latter were termed SATs - Soldiers Awaiting Training. Ultimately who gives a fuck, there really are more pressing things to raise blood pressure over.