ARmy Rumour SErvice

Originally Posted by smartascarrots

That's always been the intention, though. Right from the start, the SNP have said they intend the referendum to be of all those resident in Scotland and not just those of Scottish birth.

But the "spin" that the SNP has put on this is that they believe everyone resident in Scotland should be allowed to vote and isn't that good of them. What they don't tell you is that they have no choice in the matter and that "The right to Vote" is a human right under international Law and that residents of a legal voting age in a country MUST be given the right to vote.

They had no choice, simples.

And for B_AB
The right to vote and the right to public participation in government is asserted in Article 21 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Article 25 of the ICCPR explicitly extends the right to vote to “every citizen,”

Article 5 of the international Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination (“CERD”) requires States “to guarantee the right of everyone, without distinction as to race, colour, or national or ethnic origin

Originally Posted by 2/51

But the "spin" that the SNP has put on this is that they believe everyone resident in Scotland should be allowed to vote and isn't that good of them. What they don't tell you is that they have no choice in the matter and that "The right to Vote" is a human right under international Law and that residents of a legal voting age in a country MUST be given the right to vote.

They had no choice, simples.

International law, by definition, applies to nations. Not to regions.

Sets rather a nice precedent, doesn't it? Scotland governed by international law...

Originally Posted by 2/51

Indeed! Trouble is, I was there, you were not. I have nothing to prove to yourself. I have the unfortunate pleasure of having to deal with him on a fairly regular basis, so I get to see a lot of things that you will not.



I am probably more of an "authority" than yourself due to my contact with him and his "clan".

Insult me if you like, but you will not sway me. I have provided documented examples of his double standards, I will provide plenty more if I feel it necessary to back up an arguement.

So I was right then. Nothing more than unsubstantiated 'anecdotal' horse shit.

Originally Posted by 2/51

And for B_AB
The right to vote and the right to public participation in government is asserted in Article 21 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Article 25 of the ICCPR explicitly extends the right to vote to “every citizen,”

Article 5 of the international Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination (“CERD”) requires States “to guarantee the right of everyone, without distinction as to race, colour, or national or ethnic origin

Care to explain the relevance to me? You appear to have dragged me into someone else's argument.

what about the fact that 3 out of 4 people who claim to be scots live south of the big wall and have no desire to be repatriated.

"United we stand, divided we fall!"... I've said it on Arrse many times. Proud of being a Jock, proud of being British... no feck off Salmond.

Please, I thought this was a supposed to be a serious thread; do we have to continually denigrate each other? Most contributors have been open and transparent whilst explaining their position on a very emotive subject that has devolved into a debate about the pros and cons of devolution.

Just because I am a woman, some treat me as a second-class citizen; sorry, not having that - possibly a little more astute than many give me credit for: I see the unseen, read the unwritten, hear the unspoken and never trust politicians. Believe it or not devolution (independence) comes at a price – to all sides – nobody really gains as the financial implications are unbelievably complex – something, even I cannot get my head around. Whilst I commend Alex Salmond for his nationalistic fervour, however, he needs to temper it to a degree and not see the world through rose-tinted glasses – at present he is not seeing to the far horizons.

Yes, I am fully supporting those saying: “No, I am not Belgian, British, French, or Spanish; I am Basque, Breton, Catalan, Cornish, Flemish, Manx, Scottish, Walloon, Welsh” when asked about their nationality. It’s not that they have a particular sign or flag, it is how they feel in their hearts and that will never be taken from them. This is borne out by their stubborn insistence on identity and sense of belonging, also a stubborn resistance to change despite of the best efforts of the “States”. No matter where you look in these areas you will see the cultural spirit and the traditions are still alive and thriving in the twenty-first century.

Even if there was a referendum tomorrow and the vote was in favour of devolution it would not happen overnight – it would take years of careful preparation if the people are not to suffer. It is not as simple as turning off one tap and turning on another, to think that is to live in Electric Moo-Moo Land. A little something for people to think about; If Scotland has been independent in 2008 when RBS & HBOS were rescued by “the taxpayer” its financial system would have been swamped. A population of 5.2 million and a GDP of £140 billion would not have covered the rescue funds – believe me, my purpose in life today is to crunch numbers.

Reading this topic carefully makes me think I am beginning to see some very passionate people advocating Conflicting Nationalism – a classic example being Belgium in the 1830’s when it was formed by secession from the United Kingdom of the Netherlands when a nation-state disputed the territory. As a consequence of this, if large sections of the population reject the national identity, the legitimacy of the state is undermined, and the efficiency of the government is reduced. That has certainly been the case in Belgium, where the inter–communal tensions still dominate politics. If legitimacy fails completely, the result may be a civil war, which either leads to restoration of national unity, or to the creation of one or more new states (Zetland, Arcaibh, Na h-Eileanan Siar, just for a start) – tribalism – now that is an interesting scenario – 1692 anyone!!

Originally Posted by 2/51

The right to vote and the right to public participation in government is asserted in Article 21 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Article 25 of the ICCPR explicitly extends the right to vote to “every citizen,”

Article 5 of the international Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination (“CERD”) requires States “to guarantee the right of everyone, without distinction as to race, colour, or national or ethnic origin

Only if they have the requisite right to vote as determined by local laws. That is why when I am in the US on my hols in November I can't vote in the presidential elections