Re: accusations about alcohol. I wrote "pint down the pub", not "several bottles of White Lightning cider in a disused bus stop." In addition I included "drug and alcohol abuse" in the pro list. These are 16-year-olds, you can hardly deny the existence of alcohol any more than the colour of the sky, and 'pint down the pub' evokes community as well as drinking. Given the maturity level of the kids - all of whom voluntarily attend this after-school club - I don't believe they will come away with a false understanding of something which, for many people, better or worse, IS a major social activity in this country. Probably best qualified by "but this is only for adults, guys" but I don't think I was contributing to a social ill.

Originally Posted by telecaster

I thought "Pro" was "for", and "Con" "against".

The motion is a negative - so if you're 'pro', you DO believe Britain is broken.

Jesus. Ask any of the little Muppets to take a look at Britain any time before WW2, then come back and tell me its 'Broken'.

Which, if you wish to educate the spoiled little brats, is the Conservative & Unionist Party's worst mistake in the election run-up.

We're broken? Thanks Posh Gits. We'd be a little less Broken if your 'Lord' Ashcroft had bunged a few quid into the kitty instead of trying to Spaz elections from his fastness in, er, Belize.

We're far from perfect, but at least we have stopped burning Catholics at the stake. A mistake in the view of many of us, but it seems burning them infringes their Human Rights in some way I do not pretend to undertand.

Tell the children to take a Gap Year in the Horn of Africa then come back to the Island and tell me its 'Broken'.

I'll punch them in the mouth, but it will contribute 6 CPD points to their CV, yah?

Prison service after the Andrew. Last post before retirement,Young Offenders and remand H.M.P. Brinsford Nr Wolverhampton West MIdlands. The place held the most trash bag ,toe rag scum that would make the chav morons on Jeremy Kyle look like mensa candidates. The parents who visited them may have had a collective I.Q. of minus 7. On nights in the control room it was quite usual to receive a telephone call at midnight to the theme of" Our Johnny went to court this morning and he aint come home yet , have you got him? Britain is smashed beyond repair .

Originally Posted by jesse

Prison service after the Andrew. Last post before retirement,Young Offenders and remand H.M.P. Brinsford Nr Wolverhampton West MIdlands. The place held the most trash bag ,toe rag scum that would make the chav morons on Jeremy Kyle look like mensa candidates. The parents who visited them may have had a collective I.Q. of minus 7. On nights in the control room it was quite usual to receive a telephone call at midnight to the theme of" Our Johnny went to court this morning and he aint come home yet , have you got him? Britain is smashed beyond repair .

Hi Rozzer. Do a Google on The Border Reivers, then bleat on. A few years ago we'd have done Johnny, raped his Mum and his Dad then sold the lot to the Scots for their haggis.

Your experience doesn't mean Britain is broken. Its not Britain's fault you couldnt get a decent job.

As for the rest? If you think Britain is broken, fuck off to Greece. Its the Land of Opportunity I hear?

Fcuk me, what a question.

No I don't believe Britain is broken, BUT if the social engineering train isn't stopped soon it will smash into the buffers.
The "English" part of the UK needs to be allowed to celebrate its heritage and history without feeling dirty, why can't we have a BH for St. Georges day. If we did have the said holiday we must not let it be hijacked by the EDL, BNP and any other "right-wing" party. At the sametime I don't like what my country is becoming; dirty, self-centered, lazy, me,me,me orientated. I have 2 kids one of 17 the other 7 and I do wonder what they will inherit.
ALL immigrants should be made to learn english, no more translations, let people keep their religions but Christianity is the religion of the country and if you don't like it, ship out.

Somehow we need to snap the country out of its apathy, we are sleep-walking into a federal europe and OUR leaders are doing it and "WE" seem to not care about it.

Talking of "our" leaders we need to remind them that they serve us and not the other way round, this goes to all leaders from parish councils upwards. We could start with a constitution and the opening line could be

"WE THE PEOPLE.........................................yad a yada."

C_G

Grapevine - "These are 16-year-olds, you can hardly deny the existence of alcohol any more than the colour of the sky, and 'pint down the pub' evokes community as well as drinking.”

Oh well, excusez moi,’16 year olds’, say no more. Fully fledged adults, pillars of the community, been everywhere, done everything, know it all. No I can’t deny the existence of alcohol no more than the existence of cocaine, lysergic acid diethylamide, self loading Labradors or syphilis, but then I’ve never had anything to do with any of these so arguably am not entitled to an opinion – plus I’m not 16.

You want to play on semantics and rhetoric? - OK, I can do that. You stated:”In addition I included "drug and alcohol abuse" in the pro list”, as indeed you stated, ”and 'pint down the pub' evokes community as well as drinking”. So, it’s not that at 16 these children legally can’t go ‘down the pub’ to go ‘sur le p1ss’, and/or acquire ‘certain substances’ in the bog (at any age – or is it methadone?), but it’s only naughty if they ‘abuse’ their consumption and flout some recognised standards of ‘recreation, social or community’ use?

” Given the maturity level of the kids - all of whom voluntarily attend this after-school club”

Can’t help feeling this statement is missing the qualification that the ‘volunteers’ comprised only those who bothered to attend school in the first place, and then of those, those who actually understood the invitation – or was it expressed in 27 languages (which may or may not have included English)?

No.9

ps "not 'several bottles of White Lightning cider in a disused bus stop.' no not several bottles of White Lightning cider unless mixed with several bottles of Special Brew, unless you are in my area where it’s mixed with several bottles of Lidl’s cheapest ;)

I think Iron Duke is on the right track...however bad some people make it out to be, it's far better than it was.
Social clubs and apprentices may have had some good points, but most were in areas that relied upon single, large employers, eg mining, shipbuilding, nuclear industry etc.
As soon as Johnny Foreigner could do the same job cheaper/quicker/better those single industries were dead, as were their suppliers.
Now, at least, the brighter kids realise they don't have a "job for life" waiting in their home territory, and they look farther afield. Slag off the EU if you will, but kids with the attitude and skills now have the legal right to live and work anywhere in the EU, and they use it.
The intelligent ones know this, much like bright kids elsewhere, and use it to their benefit.
The dullards end up on YTS/Modern apprentice/whatever it's called this week schemes, as guaranteed by Gordon himself: "Every school leaver in work or training etc" My bold, because we all know the "work" will be some poorly paid existence with no long term prospects.
So the clever and well connected do well, as they always have and will, while the others have a drone-like life of semi servitude or unemployment, as they always have done.
At least now they don't starve on the streets.

Perhaps the OP might ask why the non attenders aren't there at the debate?