Thread: How can PTSD be portrayed in games? And, should it?

Originally Posted by supermatelot

* hell lobster, and even you squiggers...

Thats a serious mis reading or misunderstanding you are ranting about.

RTFT!

Oh no, I get what you're saying, i was just saying that we were looking at a slow degradation of the characters mental state is all.

So, don't worry, i'm not turning into Tropper, and i'm able to read.

What happens at the end of the game in regards to the character, even i'm not sure as of yet how we can end it to be honest. Either way, its going to take me a while to get it sounding right, and not hollywoodish.

There, IMHO, is one of your greatest hurdles. You have three options and each invites criticism.
1. His(or her) situation degrades (eg hospitalisation), in which case you are accused of selling out the character for a high impact ending, or at best following the Rambo - Jarhead path.
2. His situation improves with the help of professional or charitible organisations. You are accused of making a "public service broadcast" and not a game relevant to non-sufferers as audience.
3. His situation improves by his own hand. Accused of writing fairy stories, or not tackling the issue fully and realistically.

Why not follow not one character, but a mix? Then you can mix and match endings, in order to highlight the impact of certain choices, or communicate to the audience that PTSD is not limited to one trade, rank or situation. This would also enable you to illustrate mortality much better than is possible in film, by not bringing all of the player-characters to the end of the game. In Call of Duty 4, one of the stronger scenes involves the player character getting unavoidably zapped.

(Edited for bad counting skills)

Originally Posted by supermatelot

* hell lobster, and even you squiggers...

Thats a serious mis reading or misunderstanding you are ranting about.

RTFT!

Sorry for posting like a twat!

I was posting whilst at work so didn't fully read the thread - next time I'll read fully before engaging brain!

No probs mate :D

Originally Posted by Squiggers

Originally Posted by amazing__lobster

Originally Posted by tropper66

Originally Posted by supermatelot

You missed out the homeless chapter

Perfect! At the end of a level a video clip plays set in the future from the gameplay scenario. Cue one of the tracks from the Gladiators CD and a vision of a homeless man / man alone in flat drinking / man in punch up etc With a message explaining..example "one in ten of servicemen who...." etc etc. I think the choice of music playing in the background would be important though.

TU PAC no one give's a Fcuk about us

Are you both on crack?

That's what the OP said - to have PTSD featured in cutscenes. You've been slagging him off for the idea, but you've just suggested a scene to him

So why can't he go a stage further (and indeed more coherent), and make the plot about a guy developing PTSD.

People have said over & over again - he's not thinking of including some kind of "PTSD Mode" like the bit in pac man where you eat pills

Indeed - and thats what we're looking at, showing a slow degradation of the characters mental state over the course of the story, not them just being fine, fine, fine, *SNAP*. Showing it more subtly, for most of the game, would have far more impact, than have it being glaringly obvious - at least, until right at the end, or even after the end of the game, in the final scenes.

What happens at the end of the game in regards to the character, even i'm not sure as of yet how we can end it to be honest. Either way, its going to take me a while to get it sounding right, and not hollywoodish.

Maybe he could have the odd ND and be late for the start of a level or two?

For anyone being clinically labeled with PTSD in real life, is already going through enough with the untold amount of naf counselling sessions etc, the taking of daily medication, trying to come to terms with the injury and plod on the best they can, trying to secure some sort of stable happy future, having to avoid certain things that triggers it off that can & does cause extensive problems in everyday life for the individual person & their families.

A number of people with PTSD play video games as a way of escapism & enjoyment. They do not need or want reminding of PTSD portrayed in any form whilst trying to have some enjoyment & escape from it by playing a game.

I do not think it is appropriate to encompass PTSD in a video game. And I do not think it is appropriate for game makers to try & cash in on somebody's misfortune even if they intentions are not motivated by profit.

Originally Posted by visitor

For anyone being clinically labeled with PTSD in real life, is already going through enough with the untold amount of naf counselling sessions etc, the taking of daily medication, trying to come to terms with the injury, trying to secure some sort of stable happy future, having to avoid certain things that triggers it off that can & does cause extensive problems in everyday life for the individual person. A number of people with PTSD play video games as a way of escapism & enjoyment. They do not need or want reminding of PTSD portrayed in any form whilst trying to have some enjoyment & escape from it by playing a game.

I do not think it is appropriate to encompass PTSD in a video game play. And I do not think it is appropriate for game makers to try & cash in on somebody's misfortune.

What they said above. It's an often invisible ailment that's difficult to manage and a curse, in life. Perhaps best left alone.

Originally Posted by visitor

I do not think it is appropriate to encompass PTSD in a video game. And I do not think it is appropriate for game makers to try & cash in on somebody's misfortune even if they intentions are not motivated by profit.

I get what you're saying, however, it is classed as entirely appropriate to depict those who have suffered from other mental illnesses - schizophrenia, for example - yet PTSD, which by an large, while not something I'd wish on anyone, is shunted under the carpet.

I'd also like to add, there are several features that crop up in games now, when saying that PTSD shouldn't be included, for example in a game like Call of Duty: World at War - which features people getting burnt, and their arms/legs blown off, and rather graphic violence along with that.

If i'm honest, looking at something which, quite frankly, is ignored by the British establishment, and is only just starting to be talked about outside of the US (I refer to Europe as well here), and in my opinon, shouldn't be ignored - it can't be ignored.

Honestly, it doesn't feel right on my conscience having a main character who's seen 3 members of his team killed off, being absolutely fine. That just wouldn't look right at all.

Plus, I'd like to add, when these issues are covered by film, its not an issue, yet when injected into a game, in cutscene areas where the player has little to no action in them, it becomes an issue. =/ Ah well, bit of idle musing.

Originally Posted by Squiggers

Originally Posted by visitor

I do not think it is appropriate to encompass PTSD in a video game. And I do not think it is appropriate for game makers to try & cash in on somebody's misfortune even if they intentions are not motivated by profit.

I get what you're saying, however, it is classed as entirely appropriate to depict those who have suffered from other mental illnesses - schizophrenia, for example - yet PTSD, which by an large, while not something I'd wish on anyone, is shunted under the carpet.

I'd also like to add, there are several features that crop up in games now, when saying that PTSD shouldn't be included, for example in a game like Call of Duty: World at War - which features people getting burnt, and their arms/legs blown off, and rather graphic violence along with that.

If i'm honest, looking at something which, quite frankly, is ignored by the British establishment, and is only just starting to be talked about outside of the US (I refer to Europe as well here), and in my opinon, shouldn't be ignored - it can't be ignored.

Honestly, it doesn't feel right on my conscience having a main character who's seen 3 members of his team killed off, being absolutely fine. That just wouldn't look right at all.

Plus, I'd like to add, when these issues are covered by film, its not an issue, yet when injected into a game, in cutscene areas where the player has little to no action in them, it becomes an issue. =/ Ah well, bit of idle musing.

Fuck em, just do it. Let the grief whores continue their wailing and teeth gnashing. If they don't like it, they don't have to play it. Seemples.

Originally Posted by Squiggers

I get what you're saying, however, it is classed as entirely appropriate to depict those who have suffered from other mental illnesses - schizophrenia, for example - yet PTSD, which by an large, while not something I'd wish on anyone, is shunted under the carpet.

I'd also like to add, there are several features that crop up in games now, when saying that PTSD shouldn't be included, for example in a game like Call of Duty: World at War - which features people getting burnt, and their arms/legs blown off, and rather graphic violence along with that.

If i'm honest, looking at something which, quite frankly, is ignored by the British establishment, and is only just starting to be talked about outside of the US (I refer to Europe as well here), and in my opinon, shouldn't be ignored - it can't be ignored.

This is something that does rattle my cage, PTSD is not a mental illness as you describe. It is a Injury. Two totally different things.

I do however agree with you that the British Establishment are somewhat lacking behind in the education & treatment of that injury, which is my mind is pretty piss poor for a country that has such a close special relationship with the US.

As for the games you mentioned that already incorporate PTSD cut scenes, well I've never played them so I really cannot pass comment on something I have no knowledge of.

As for the way its portrayed in certain films, well its always been a issue as far I can remember, but the actors and production team do consult persons with the injury, especially the actor playing the part will have done a lot of research & spent time with a PTSD injured person. (The obvious film I could relate to & remember seeing would be Clint Eastwood in the 1980's film Firefox).

So that when the actor gives the best performance they can in front of the camera it receives minimal negative attention, however, human emotion in films comes across to the wider audience in a different way than it that does with animation creations in games, & that would be the obvious difference between game playing and film.

Even though gaming graphics & realism have come a long way in their development, it still has a long way to go before something like PTSD could be portrayed in a correct way, and I still think it is something that should not be in a game, but that's just my view and your points were valid & reasonable.

If humans started to relate to games more than they do with real life or films, then I think there would a very unhealthy balance going on.

Originally Posted by visitor

A number of people with PTSD play video games as a way of escapism & enjoyment. They do not need or want reminding of PTSD portrayed in any form whilst trying to have some enjoyment & escape from it by playing a game.

Realistically would someone suffering from PTSD be playing a game depicting death, mutilation etc? Surely that defeats the object of 'escape & enjoyment'. Let's be honest, what squiggers is suggesting is only going to be part of a war game, not the Sims type game etc.

Originally Posted by visitor

This is something that does rattle my cage, PTSD is not a mental illness as you describe. It is a Injury. Two totally different things.

I do however agree with you that the British Establishment are somewhat lacking behind in the education & treatment of that injury, which is my mind is pretty piss poor for a country that has such a close special relationship with the US.

As for the games you mentioned that already incorporate PTSD cut scenes, well I've never played them so I really cannot pass comment on something I have no knowledge of.

I wouldn't say that its a an Injury alone - its a combination of mental illness, and an injury, in my opinion. Part of the reason why some are effected worse than others, and why some people aren't effected at all by it.

Now, I didn't actually say that there were other games that incorporated PTSD - I said there were other games that incorporated other illnesses, such as Schizophrenia, for example.

As for the way its portrayed in certain films, well its always been a issue as far I can remember, but the actors and production team do consult persons with the injury, especially the actor playing the part will have done a lot of research & spent time with a PTSD injured person. (The obvious film I could relate to & remember seeing would be Clint Eastwood in the 1980's film Firefox).

So that when the actor gives the best performance they can in front of the camera it receives minimal negative attention, however, human emotion in films comes across to the wider audience in a different way than it that does with animation creations in games, & that would be the obvious difference between game playing and film.

Main reason why I've been asking for people's stories - received a few already, particularly in regard to how their day-to-day life is. I'm attempting to do as much research on the subject as I can, but to be honest, you can't ever do enough research to accurately portray a condition, if you don't have it yourself - and thats where my problem lies for the most part.

Now, thats the thing - today, we've got it to the point where you can accurately portray facial expression, voice, actions... Not to the extent where its mirroring real life, but its slowly getting a lot better than it was in the 90's for example. I do agree with what you're saying though - its a lot more difficult to portray these kind of scenes in 3D, than with live action. (In all fairness, the live action option for cutscenes has crossed my mind, but the added cost, particularly for something thats an unpaid project, isn't something I can fund, unfortunately.).

Even though gaming graphics & realism have come a long way in their development, it still has a long way to go before something like PTSD could be portrayed in a correct way, and I still think it is something that should not be in a game, but that's just my view and your points were valid & reasonable.

If humans started to relate to games more than they do with real life or films, then I think there would a very unhealthy balance going on.

Yeah, i do get what you're saying - it makes a refreshing change to have some rational argument, rather than the likes of tropper69 blowing his top.

Unfortunately, some people are starting to - part of the reason why teenagers are referred to as the "Console Generation", as its so easy to just lob something in the 360 and get playing. I mean, look at the Halo franchise, for instance. The fans of that are a prime example of what I mean.

Not that I like it, of course - I prefer spending more time in the outdoors than being sat on my backside on the 360 playing on the likes of Halo.