Whether decompresion is a good idea or not, if it needs to be done, make it part of the deployment; that way making it nigh-on impossible for us to riggle out of doing it. Leave it till after we are with our families and back with our squadron etc and we can pick and choose what we 'need'.

Originally Posted by JonnoJonno

Whether decompresion is a good idea or not, if it needs to be done, make it part of the deployment; that way making it nigh-on impossible for us to riggle out of doing it. Leave it till after we are with our families and back with our squadron etc and we can pick and choose what we 'need'.

If decompression is to work for all, then as harsh as it may sound, it has to be done by ALL those returning from ops and before they have a chance to unwind with their loved ones. As once you have returned from leave, you may already have had run in's with wife / girlfrend / parents, with you saying "You weren't there, you don't know what your talking about"!

It is a chance in slow time for all those who you served next to, to chat about the whole op, you personal experiances and how you handled them, as well as a chance to get the pent up frustrations and anger out of your system that will if goes uncheck cause you and those you love very real problems going forward together.

Yes, that was the point I was trying (through a cider induced hangover) to make. Part of deployment orders; no excuses etc.

Originally Posted by JonnoJonno

and we can pick and choose what we 'need'.

And if you are at risk / suffering with, how can the individual be left to choose what he or she thinks they need and as a part of this immidiate families have to be a part of the same procedure.

And this has to be done within the same teams you were deployed into combat with, those you have rellied upon to safe you life, as you have theirs.

The problem is we believe we are big tough men / women, who have been trained to be the best, yet there are those who look and sound tough on the outside but inside they have the same feelings and if not released in a contolled manner will manifest themselves into some form of Mental Health illness, while some may escape through the bottom of a glass / bottle time and time again, until you accept perhaps, just perhaps you might have a problem, all you is cheat yourself and delay the onset of help and treatments.

Sorry, I was not being clear on my previous post. I agree entirely with your point of view. Yes we need to have a compulsory decompression etc.

If not we get back to our families and do not do anything about it because we have the perception that we don't 'need' the help; which is where the 'denial' issues cause their greatest damage to ourselves and our family.

Originally Posted by JonnoJonno

Sorry, I was not being clear on my previous post. I agree entirely with your point of view. Yes we need to have a compulsory decompression etc.

If not we get back to our families and do not do anything about it because we have the perception that we don't 'need' the help; which is where the 'denial' issues cause their greatest damage to ourselves and our family.

At the risk of being pedantic, as I've already posted this once-

http://www.kcl.ac.uk/kcmhr/informati...ompression.pdf

On the current state of knowledge, no one really knows (a) if decompression works anyway and (b) what form it should take. As far as I can see, its main function at present is to give senior people in the MOD a warm, fuzzy feeling that they're doing 'something' about stress.

Originally Posted by CharlieBubbles

If we may get back on thread for those who are sitting reading this, who now have some form of Combat / Service Related Mental Health illness.
A very good point about those who have served with the TA in conflict, where are their support mechanisms?

Decompression was a good idea in therory, however, in practice who wants to spend a week or so back ion camp prior to going on leave? I would suggest very few if any! Yet unless individuals / groups are given a period of "NORAMALISATION", they will take their experiance out on those who only see a changed man or woman, who they once knew2 and loved, who is now someone carrying a problem, that if is not indentified and treated at the earliest oppertunity, will go onto suffer some form of Mental Health illness.

Perhaps it is not a quarter, but there has been a significant rise in numbers and no matter what others do or say, we will over the next 5, 10, 15 years, see a more rapid increase in those who through their conbat experiance will fall to pieces. Without help and treatment now, this will happen!£

Here-

http://www.army.mod.uk/welfare-suppo...ily/13672.aspx

Originally Posted by Neuroleptic

Originally Posted by CharlieBubbles

If we may get back on thread for those who are sitting reading this, who now have some form of Combat / Service Related Mental Health illness.
A very good point about those who have served with the TA in conflict, where are their support mechanisms?

Decompression was a good idea in therory, however, in practice who wants to spend a week or so back ion camp prior to going on leave? I would suggest very few if any! Yet unless individuals / groups are given a period of "NORAMALISATION", they will take their experiance out on those who only see a changed man or woman, who they once knew2 and loved, who is now someone carrying a problem, that if is not indentified and treated at the earliest oppertunity, will go onto suffer some form of Mental Health illness.

Perhaps it is not a quarter, but there has been a significant rise in numbers and no matter what others do or say, we will over the next 5, 10, 15 years, see a more rapid increase in those who through their conbat experiance will fall to pieces. Without help and treatment now, this will happen!£

Here-

http://www.army.mod.uk/welfare-suppo...ily/13672.aspx

Thanks for the link. Quoted from the link:
'Any individual, who thinks that they are eligible to access the programme and feels they need an opinion, should ask their General Practitioner to refer them to this service.'

It is the self referral issue that Charlie and I were going over, but I do see your point about the lack of evidence to illustrate the successes of decompression. For myself I would welcome the opportunity to decompress prior to returning to civvy life, but am aware that this won't suit everyone.

Originally Posted by psychobabble

Originally Posted by Tremaine

Worth remembering perhaps that there are different viewpoints and differing, researched; opinions across institutions and medics, worldwide. What we see here are opinions, perhaps based on experience or "the line", but not definitive and sometimes unhelpful. That suggests an agenda with which some of us should feel uncomfortable. We may not have the monopoly in UK nor can ours be the only, valid, viewpoints.

There are possibly no such things as definitive answers to this subject because if there were, we fail.

For instance: If we attribute the majority, even most of PTSD sufferers' histories and symptons to childhood abuse or addictions, we do the sufferers an injustice. Aside from prejudice,and anything else that would not be acceptable in Health and Social Care values.

Since C S are mentioned here it's worth quoting their web page

"Combat Stress is the leading charity specialising in the care of British Veterans who have been profoundly traumatised by harrowing experiences during their Service career and who are suffering from poor mental health as a result.

Many Veterans leave the Armed Forces with highly debilitating conditions such as Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD), depression and anxiety disorders. Their problems can remain masked for years, and they and their families may be struggling to deal with matters at home. Combat Stress is able to provide two integrated services to meet Veterans' needs"

What might be important are some views whereby PTSD is part of a range of psychosocial ailments and each individual case will be unique. One service's opinions and one sufferer's condition will not tally perfectly with all the others' - that would be crass, and idle of us.....

In my profession we work on "facts and needs". What has happened in the past, client needs- (as far as they can decide) in agreement with the professional helper. Numerous agencies, appropriate, and with the wherewithal to help suffers, are used as part of a networked care plan. To denigrate patients/clients in sweeping statements is at best insulting, at worst it is unprofessional.

I'm sorry but this is muddled and confused. It's similar to trying to deny the existence of flu. This is not opinion, it's accepted fact across the medical communities of at least the western world, not just the MOD - there IS a condition known as PTSD, it's been acknowledged worldwide as a condition and defined in terms of symptoms and treatment programmes. I've not seen any sensible research that disputes this, perhaps you'd like to point me in the direction of some?

I have no agenda related to PTSD apart from ensuring that people get appropriate treatment at the appropriate time and I'm sure I can speak for Neuroleptic and the other nurses/therapists who post on here in that respect.

I cannot see how we can be doing sufferers an injustice by saying that the majority who present to the NHS have suffered abuse. That's how it is. It may not fit with your view of the world but there isn't a lot I can do about that.

No-one is saying that everyone who suffers from PTSD has been abused, but many have. There are many other causes too, not least of which is that related to combat. There isn't any reasearch that links PTSD to mild traumatic brain injury in any formal manner yet and as we know that appropriate CBT/EMDR works for many (as shown by much evidence) I'm not about to change practice just yet.

Of course each case is unique, as it is with any illness but this doesn't mean that no-one has PTSD. It is an illness that needs an individual approach, but for most this means CBT/EMDR of some description. This doesn't mean that making statements about causal factors is denigrating, it's the same as saying that most people with a strep infection respond to antibiotics. They aren't all identical but most have roughly the same pattern of symptoms and respond to the same treatments.

If you say so.

Originally Posted by psychobabble

IAPT was never supposed to be in place last month, that's when the implementation was to start and the PCTs who were chosen were informed about 5 weeks prior to this. We (and others) are now putting this into place and recruiting and the service in our area should start to operate at a basic level in September, with more therapists coming online once they are trained. There aren't enough ready qualified ones currently to satisfy the demand (and who applied) so we are putting some through diploma/degree level training.

So why did Ben Bradshaw MP (Dept of Health) make out this is the future of when he released it last November, when they had no intentiion to even recruit for many months down the line. This is so typical of the NHS in many areas, especially ' Mental Health' provision, or the lack of it!
In the said document, it mentions Veterans and March 09 for implimentaion, why did they bother ever releasing the IAPT, when it was still a 'Pipe Dream', as with those who have read it, would have believed that more detail would have been released for Veterans and the actual scheme was ready to operate, or again was this just more spin from the minister and civil servants at the Dept of Health