Thread: You have been awarded an MSc in Information Security Mgmt

Originally Posted by Alsacien

Originally Posted by quiller

and for little pounds a Graduateship (GCGI) - city and guilds senior award for your level.

The Graduateship award is at a middle management level and is mapped to a British Honours degree and level 6 on the National Qualification Framework (NQF).

..just don't bother putting it on any CV that I look at...

are they really not worth pursuing? i can get a GCGI for a small fee in my field of expertise - is it worth it?

Originally Posted by CRmeansCeilingReached

Originally Posted by Alsacien

Originally Posted by quiller

and for little pounds a Graduateship (GCGI) - city and guilds senior award for your level.

The Graduateship award is at a middle management level and is mapped to a British Honours degree and level 6 on the National Qualification Framework (NQF).

..just don't bother putting it on any CV that I look at...

are they really not worth pursuing? i can get a GCGI for a small fee in my field of expertise - is it worth it?

I think you answered your own question..... if the the person hiring knows the game it will be seen as mickey mouse.

The market is overflowing with masters graduates right now, with little or no practical experience.
Degrees become rather obsolete in many cases, it ticks a box though and shows ability - but again, most recruiters (especially in UK) would prefer experience over quals. Industry quals like CISSP etc are good to have - but again I will only tick a box - it is up to date experience that counts. Personally I would trade the lot for a system architect or security expert with SAP ERP experience......

Here is the standard English blurb that is used by all the European agencies I use - generic for all IT professional profiles up to Programme Manager:

i. A level of education which corresponds to completed university studies attested by a diploma in one of the following fields: computer science, mathematics, economics or engineering, or related areas, when the normal period of university education is four (4) years or more; or
ii. A level of education which corresponds to completed university studies attested by a diploma in one of the following fields: computer science, mathematics, economics or engineering, or related areas, and appropriate professional experience of at least one (1) year when the normal period of university education is at least three (3) years;
iii. In addition to the above, either in case A(i) or A(ii), at least six (6) years of relevant and proven professional experience gained after obtaining the diploma;

Wading in to the Senior Awards debate; I feel(hope) they are useful. They translate what you have done onto your CV, as a TA punter I have very little TA on my CV (1 sentence in other interests). I don't think they are a substitute for qualifications or experience but they do allow my military experience to be civilianised in a sense.

I am interested in other peoples views, and acknowledge Alsacien's view of mickey mouseness.

Congratulations MSR, I am now in your wake

Originally Posted by msr

Have CISSP, now starting on CISM and CEH, oh and a PhD

MSR

You have time to do other courses on top of your PhD!? :D

You're not doing your PhD with the OU by any chance, are you?

edit: the final sentence shouldn't be taken as a negative, btw!

Originally Posted by Crouch_and_Hold

.....and now you've got lots of time on your hands to get a life!

You haven't said much in 4 years but that statement is a Classic and destined to make it into the book of "All Time Classic Quotes from ARRSE" :D

Made me Snigger anyway

Nice One...

Originally Posted by msr

with Distinction

Which university? I saw some interesting infosec and cryptology courses advertised at Royal Holloway College in London. Quite expensive though.

Originally Posted by Ancient_Mariner

Originally Posted by msr

with Distinction

Which university? I saw some interesting infosec and cryptology courses advertised at Royal Holloway College in London. Quite expensive though.

Originally Posted by amazing__lobster

Originally Posted by msr

Have CISSP, now starting on CISM and CEH, oh and a PhD

MSR

You have time to do other courses on top of your PhD!? :D

You're not doing your PhD with the OU by any chance, are you?

University of Salford on both counts.

Originally Posted by Alsacien

Degrees become rather obsolete in many cases, it ticks a box though and shows ability - but again, most recruiters (especially in UK) would prefer experience over quals. Industry quals like CISSP etc are good to have - but again I will only tick a box - it is up to date experience that counts. Personally I would trade the lot for a system architect or security expert with SAP ERP experience......

And then you wonder why you can't find anyone with SAP ERP security experience...

Originally Posted by msr

Originally Posted by Alsacien

Degrees become rather obsolete in many cases, it ticks a box though and shows ability - but again, most recruiters (especially in UK) would prefer experience over quals. Industry quals like CISSP etc are good to have - but again I will only tick a box - it is up to date experience that counts. Personally I would trade the lot for a system architect or security expert with SAP ERP experience......

And then you wonder why you can't find anyone with SAP ERP security experience...

Uh, nobody can, for good reasons......its called the job market.

Originally Posted by msr

with Distinction

good skills - well done mate!

Originally Posted by Alsacien

Originally Posted by msr

Originally Posted by Alsacien

Degrees become rather obsolete in many cases, it ticks a box though and shows ability - but again, most recruiters (especially in UK) would prefer experience over quals. Industry quals like CISSP etc are good to have - but again I will only tick a box - it is up to date experience that counts. Personally I would trade the lot for a system architect or security expert with SAP ERP experience......

And then you wonder why you can't find anyone with SAP ERP security experience...

Uh, nobody can, for good reasons......its called the job market.

No job-> No experience. No experience -> no job.

Originally Posted by msr

Originally Posted by Alsacien

Originally Posted by msr

Originally Posted by Alsacien

Degrees become rather obsolete in many cases, it ticks a box though and shows ability - but again, most recruiters (especially in UK) would prefer experience over quals. Industry quals like CISSP etc are good to have - but again I will only tick a box - it is up to date experience that counts. Personally I would trade the lot for a system architect or security expert with SAP ERP experience......

And then you wonder why you can't find anyone with SAP ERP security experience...

Uh, nobody can, for good reasons......its called the job market.

No job-> No experience. No experience -> no job.

Exactly the point, make yourself employable. A high level academic CV will not help without a parallel practical development, it will hinder in my experience.
Get some time in with your CISSP (IIRC you need 5 years practical experience to get CISM anyway??), if you want to be on the employment market.

This could go round and round for a very long time unless someone sees that academic quals are useful...

Originally Posted by msr

This could go round and round for a very long time unless someone sees that academic quals are useful...

Welcome to the real world outside the college gates...... what you can do counts more than what you know. Recruiting is an overhead, the better the guarantee on the body, the more likely you are to hire that body.

I would honestly prefer a CISSP who was working on a helpdesk 5 years ago, than one straight out of university. Less risk.