Originally Posted by IgorTheHunchback

Of course, them evil Russians. You kind of not getting it. The Uks shut off EVERYTHING. And Oleh Dubina plainly said that the Ukrainean gas transport system is completely authonomized since 0101.

You are getting your information mixed up, confused, and thus wrong.

Originally Posted by whitecity

Originally Posted by Domovoy

Once more:

1. Ukraine, according to Naftogaz, didn't open the taps on a border with Russia;
2. What's wrong with Sudza route, apart from Ukraine needs 140m m3 and 36 hours to fill the line?
3. "...the transit pipelines in Ukraine were filled with Russian gas. Therefore, the pipeline pressure is supposed to be sufficient for ensuring synchronous gas flow at the entry and exit points of the Ukrainian gas transmission system. Once we feed gas to the entry point, it is to appear at the exit point!" (Gazprom).

Once more:
1. I'm not denying this. Have not denied this. Nor will I do so.
2. Look at a map.
3. Find out whether Naftogaz continued pumping into Slovakia AFTER Russia closed the pipes and for how long.

1. That's why gas didn't go to Europe today.
2. So? If the pipes are full it shouldn't matter.
3. Once again: Naftogaz shut the pipes to Europe before Russia turned off the taps to Ukraine. Have a look at the timeline of the conflict.

Originally Posted by Domovoy

Originally Posted by whitecity

Originally Posted by Domovoy

Once more:

1. Ukraine, according to Naftogaz, didn't open the taps on a border with Russia;
2. What's wrong with Sudza route, apart from Ukraine needs 140m m3 and 36 hours to fill the line?
3. "...the transit pipelines in Ukraine were filled with Russian gas. Therefore, the pipeline pressure is supposed to be sufficient for ensuring synchronous gas flow at the entry and exit points of the Ukrainian gas transmission system. Once we feed gas to the entry point, it is to appear at the exit point!" (Gazprom).

Once more:
1. I'm not denying this. Have not denied this. Nor will I do so.
2. Look at a map.
3. Find out whether Naftogaz continued pumping into Slovakia AFTER Russia closed the pipes and for how long.

1. That's why gas didn't go to Europe today.
2. So? If the pipes are full it shouldn't matter.
3. Once again: Naftogaz shut the pipes to Europe before Russia turned off the taps to Ukraine. Have a look at the timeline of the conflict.

1. So it seems. But then again, it would have helped if Russia had decided to send the gas on a sensible route.
2. The route and the quantity in the pipes are mutually exclusive.
3. Try again to find out whether Naftogaz continued pumping into Slovakia AFTER Russia closed the pipes and for how long.

And on a different tack, this has been up on The Telegraph all day:
Ukraine blocks gas after Russia turns taps on

It's recently been changed to this:
Russia accused of playing 'trick' as gas turned off again

OF course, the Telegraph found itself in an uncomfortable position of defending Russia. Probably was told to change the tune.

CNN: Ukraine's state-run gas company, Naftogaz, confirmed that it had stopped Russian gas flowing into Ukraine. It appeared to blame a procedural fault between the two companies.

"Naftogaz of Ukraine hereby declares that these volumes and directions (of gas) have not been timely agreed between two operators of the neighboring gas transport systems," the company said in a written statement.

"The company is convinced that in order to ensure stable gas transit ... the parties have to update and re-execute documents to regulate transparently the technical and technological coordination of the neighboring gas transport systems' operation."

And as to the Telegraph article about Russian side blocking the independent experts from entering te gas meter stations -- the EU officials made formal apologies to this erroneous statement issued earlier due to some confusion. I saw this with my own eyes on Russian TV, namely the EU officials apologizing.

Originally Posted by whitecity

1. So it seems. But then again, it would have helped if Russia had decided to send the gas on a sensible route.
2. The route and the quantity in the pipes are mutually exclusive.
3. Try again to find out whether Naftogaz continued pumping into Slovakia AFTER Russia closed the pipes and for how long.

And on a different tack, this has been up on The Telegraph all day:
Ukraine blocks gas after Russia turns taps on

It's recently been changed to this:
Russia accused of playing 'trick' as gas turned off again

1. So, Ukraine sabotaging the transit of gas to Europe by not opening the taps is Russia's fault? Whitecity, you surpassed yourself, your bias is breathtaking! :D

2. And just what this gobbledygook suppose to mean?
Official Ukraine stated that the system has been working "in reverse" from European border (West Ukraine) to the East to keep Donbass with gas. What they don't say is that Donbass has 98% of Ukrainian gas that it sends westwards (along many sideroads, as you put it), and not the other way round. The reason the pipeline started working "in reverse" is that Ukraine was hoping to refill empty pipes, unfortunately, Russia started pumping gas towards Ukrainian system in the morning not giving Ukraine enough time (36 hours) to cover the tracks.

3. I'm not going to repeat myself for the third time.

I'm surprised English-speaking media printed "Ukraine blocks gas after Russia turns taps on" in the first place!

13.01
Ukrainian parliament asked Timoshenko and Yuschenko to come and explain why "Ukraine" and "theft" became synonyms.

Timoshenko came, but didn't say a word; Yuschenko didn't bother coming.

Originally Posted by Domovoy

Originally Posted by whitecity

1. So it seems. But then again, it would have helped if Russia had decided to send the gas on a sensible route.
2. The route and the quantity in the pipes are mutually exclusive.
3. Try again to find out whether Naftogaz continued pumping into Slovakia AFTER Russia closed the pipes and for how long.

And on a different tack, this has been up on The Telegraph all day:
Ukraine blocks gas after Russia turns taps on

It's recently been changed to this:
Russia accused of playing 'trick' as gas turned off again

1. So, Ukraine sabotaging the transit of gas to Europe by not opening the taps is Russia's fault? Whitecity, you surpassed yourself, your bias is breathtaking! :D

2. And just what this gobbledygook suppose to mean?
Official Ukraine stated that the system has been working "in reverse" from European border (West Ukraine) to the East to keep Donbass with gas. What they don't say is that Donbass has 98% of Ukrainian gas that it sends westwards (along many sideroads, as you put it), and not the other way round. The reason the pipeline started working "in reverse" is that Ukraine was hoping to refill empty pipes, unfortunately, Russia started pumping gas towards Ukrainian system in the morning not giving Ukraine enough time (36 hours) to cover the tracks.

3. I'm not going to repeat myself for the third time.

I'm surprised English-speaking media printed "Ukraine blocks gas after Russia turns taps on" in the first place!

1. And your blindness to reality is beyond comprehension. There are several places gas crosses the boder from Russia into Ukraine. Russia ONLY opened supplies at one point - NONE of the others. It opened them at a point, and specified where that gas should be delivered to, that is quite inappropriate for the system.

If you set an impossible task, you will get a failed response. Ukraine duly failed.

2. The Russians specified a route that required gas to be pumped for about 250km up a main pipe in reverse to normal. If what you say is true, then it would have helped get the flow to Bulgaria quicker. Doh!!! Look at the pipeline map.

3. Didn't like what you found?

[hr]

Yesterday, Russia said it would restart supplies to Europe this morning. It did NOT start resupplies to Europe it sent a relatively pitiful "test" sample. It then demanded that a decent amount of gas be pumped along a deliberately tortuous route which it knew Ukraine would refuse. Russia made NO attempt to restore NORMAL service to Europe.

You can go on and on about alleged empty pipes, trickery to keep the Donbass warm and Ukraine's refusal to freeze a large chunk of its population, but you cannot escape the reality that Russia did NOT open the taps to restore normal service to Europe. Europe was expecting 275 mm3 or more, Russia only offered 76 mm3 to Bulgaria.

Moreover, by refusing to allow gas through Pysarivka and Valuyki because they are not "export" routes, they are contradicting themselves since they were pumping gas through those very points between 1 and 5 January. Valuyki being the normal entry point for gas to Bulgaria and Turkey.

Thanks for the background context and link to the report/original. Or is this just your own words?

Originally Posted by Domovoy

13.01
Ukrainian parliament asked Timoshenko and Yuschenko to come and explain why "Ukraine" and "theft" became synonyms.

Because people like you have been banging it out non-stop for the past 2 weeks.

It's an old PR/propaganda tool, if you keep saying the same thing over and over again, people will believe it - irrespective of whether it is true or not. How many people still believe there was/is WMD in Iraq?

Happy New Year Domovoy. :D