ARmy Rumour SErvice

Originally Posted by Wordsmith

Now - as is becoming hugely apparent - UK PLC cannot afford the size of welfare bill we currently have Wordsmith

Actually we can! The only people who want us to beleave that there is no money, are those who want to give £40,000 tax cuts to millionaires as well as not bothering the banks for the repayment of the money they lifted from the gullible government of the day.
Benefits are paid by contributions known as NI contributions, these payments made by the working tax payer are hypothecated for the payment of benefits for those who have paid there contributions. Which means that they are not mixed up with general tax or spending, and never have been. This fund has been in surplus every year since 1979, when the great asset striper adolf thatcher started to con the public. The reason why the government don't let you know any of this is they want to treat you all like sheep and do there dirty work, in stripping paid for benefits from those who when they were working paid there contributions when they were able to work.
Think of it like this, you paid into an insurance policy called GB Plc, your wife dies and the said same insurance company tells you to get stuffed, it ain't paying you. Feel great, you do not.
Don't think of NI contributions as just another tax, but that insurance policy GB Plc?
Shafted?
Yep welcome to the great benefit con.

Originally Posted by AIRBORNEJOCK

If we have these 25bn cuts does that mean we can afford cats and traps for the carriers?.....

Well, there are two or possibly three issues here.

The first is that cats and traps were of the electromagnetic type. Not the old tried and trusted steam types. The matelots may well be able to inform me of the differences but from my point of view, if we want a carrier to be on par with the US or France then the simple steam operated variation would be the norm. Not to speculate on a different and largely untried method. Of course, our carriers may not be able to deliver either system.
Secondly, the governments (by that I mean the last three, under Blair, Brown and Cameron) dont seem to be able to hold a coherent strategy for military assets for much longer than a few months. This may be due to the complete inability to negotiate a contract efficiently or being so politically micromanaged that any actual manufacture of a ship is difficult. Fitting it with an efficient aircraft means that the only solution is to adopt a mongrel of an aircraft just to make a deadline. (My third point kinda blends into the last one in that the aircraft carrier is going to be a mongrel too)

Originally Posted by Biscuits_AB

There's 3 or 4 I'm hoping will die before their 55. I say 55, as for added badness I want to see them denied their pensions!

You'd better not mean me mister.

Originally Posted by Robbeaus

Benefits are paid by contributions known as NI contributions, these payments made by the working tax payer are hypothecated for the payment of benefits for those who have paid there contributions. Which means that they are not mixed up with general tax or spending, and never have been. This fund has been in surplus every year since 1979, when the great asset striper adolf thatcher started to con the public. The reason why the government don't let you know any of this is they want to treat you all like sheep and do there dirty work, in stripping paid for benefits from those who when they were working paid there contributions when they were able to work.

It doesn't matter what a single tax brings in - what matters is the total state of UK finances. Overall we are still borrowing money because the government is spending far more than it brings in in tax. Here are the Taxpayer's alliance figures as to how fast our debt is being run up:

UK Debt Clock Tour

• £5,169 per second
• £310,212 per minute
• £18,607,306 per hour
• £446,575,342 per day

The average person in the UK earns £25,000 a year. If they pay about a fifth of their income in tax and NI, it means that the governments income from a single tax payer is being burnt through in a single second. We cannot afford wishful thinking - UK PLC is deep in debt and getting deeper in by the day. If UK PLC was a genuine company, we would have called in the administrators by now.

The biggest con is to pretend that we can go in the way we are - as it is we are going to be 25 years getting our national debt back down to a reasonable level.

Wordsmith

Originally Posted by Wordsmith

It doesn't matter what a single tax brings in - what matters is the total state of UK finances. Overall we are still borrowing money because the government is spending far more than it brings in in tax. Here are the Taxpayer's alliance figures as to how fast our debt is being run up:

UK Debt Clock Tour

• £5,169 per second
• £310,212 per minute
• £18,607,306 per hour
• £446,575,342 per day

The average person in the UK earns £25,000 a year. If they pay about a fifth of their income in tax and NI, it means that the governments income from a single tax payer is being burnt through in a single second. We cannot afford wishful thinking - UK PLC is deep in debt and getting deeper in by the day. If UK PLC was a genuine company, we would have called in the administrators by now.

The biggest con is to pretend that we can go in the way we are - as it is we are going to be 25 years getting our national debt back down to a reasonable level.

Wordsmith

That's great, they'll never pay off the debts and will keep spunking up money abroad or on the lazy. I'm sure such debates have gone on forever but whilever the money keeps going abroad i'll not believe we are bankrupt because it's not true.

Originally Posted by jarrod248

That's great, they'll never pay off the debts and will keep spunking up money abroad or on the lazy. I'm sure such debates have gone on forever but whilever the money keeps going abroad i'll not believe we are bankrupt because it's not true.

We are bankrupt - its just to an international investor we're somewhat less bankrupt than large parts of mainland Europe. Given the choice between investing in Greece or the UK, its not difficult to decide what to do.

The first problem UK PLC has is the pretence that there are easy solutions to the the debt mess we are in. There are none. All solutions involve some degree of pain - the only question is where that pain falls.

The next problem is to make sure that pain falls where it can best be borne.

-- I would like to think that someone with cerebral palsy got sufficient support from the state that they could live with a degree of comfort and dignity
-- Conversely, I would like think that Wayne and Waynetta have just enough to keep a roof over their heads and feed themselves with no room for luxuries.

The problem is that the UK's welfare state has moved away from being a safety net for the needy to being a universal entitlement. We will not get our debt under control until we focus on ensuring the needy are looked fully after and the feckless are not.

Wordsmith

Originally Posted by Wordsmith

We are bankrupt - its just to an international investor we're somewhat less bankrupt than large parts of mainland Europe. Given the choice between investing in Greece or the UK, its not difficult to decide what to do.

The first problem UK PLC has is the pretence that there are easy solutions to the the debt mess we are in. There are none. All solutions involve some degree of pain - the only question is where that pain falls.

The next problem is to make sure that pain falls where it can best be borne.

-- I would like to think that someone with cerebral palsy got sufficient support from the state that they could live with a degree of comfort and dignity
-- Conversely, I would like think that Wayne and Waynetta have just enough to keep a roof over their heads and feed themselves with no room for luxuries.

The problem is that the UK's welfare state has moved away from being a safety net for the needy to being a universal entitlement. We will not get our debt under control until we focus on ensuring the needy are looked fully after and the feckless are not.

Wordsmith

The debt will never be under control it's just a way of manipulating and controlling the people who do not understand economics, then they don't either. It's a supermarket sweep for the Tories and they will Spend, spend, spend just like the last lot.

Originally Posted by Markintime

Why do you think that someone who is totally incapacitated is suddenly going to have all benefits withdrawn?

Do you feel that we should just give DLA out to anyone without bothering to see if they need it?

However he is talking about getting people who can work (single mothers, long term unemployed etc) back to work, why do you think this is such a bad thing?

And how many jobs is this goverment creating?

I can tell you which sector will grow if this happens crime! and who will stop it? the Police? or whats left of them.

It sounds good getting everyone back to work, but for that jobs as well as growth in the economy are needed and the banks need to lend and thats just not happening.