ARmy Rumour SErvice

At least the guys were Muslim, no chance of the offence being buried under the carpet then.

Originally Posted by Provost

This is what happens when a repressed (and repressive) culture with a complete disdain for 'kufr' comes into contact with the product of a feckless, dissolute and chaotic white underclass.

Matters apparently made a lot worse by a criminal justice system that is in total denial and is immobilised into inactivity for fear of being branded racist. Even faced with the facts and the statistics of which they are normally so enamoured, they continue to refuse to acknowledge that a very considerable problem exists.

I couldn't have put it better myself. I do wish people would stop confusing race and belief. However, this issue (conveniently for some) encompasses both. If those who subscribe to a certain faith wish to treat anyone else who doesn't share their view as untermentch filth - only suitable for raping and the odd Youtube appearance sans swede - then expect some incoming from the opposition.

Originally Posted by Taffd

After a bite eh? Ok, I'll go for it.

I don't necessarily have a stance on many things. Oft times I'm ambivalent. Oddly enough, I don't jump on every outrage bus that comes along, though I'm sure it would make it easier for folks to cast the first rock, if I did.

'Course, in this case, I could have been outraged either way. Either at the crims, some of the portrayal of their culture/religion, at our religion/culture, at other peoples' outrage . . . the list could go on.

I don't take a stance on every news report, of every crime, and of everybody else's feelings about it. Here, I didn't see a salacious court case and take an avid interest in the ongoing proceedings and successive fallout.

I happened to click on the thread because it was getting lots of responses quickly, usually caused by a disagreement.

I noted good points made from a number of angles and posted questions to elicit further discourse. In the course of events, I found MiTs arguments to be persuasive. He also acknowledges the relevance of some of the points raised by others.

What I glean from your input thus far, is that you seem to be looking for 'isms', for somewhere to play the race card, for somebody to accuse.

I could be wrong of course. I'm open to persuasive argument.

Sorry. I read your post very carefully and I still can't see a solid opinion about anything. You 'could have been outraged either way' but, presumably weren't. You 'happened' to click on the thread, presumably not through a magnificent, dominant control of your mouse. You mention the 'relevance of some points', arguments that were 'persuasive' but not winning or losing....

You seem to toy with ideas, tickling them like a trout in a stream, but if you thought you'd actually catch one, you'd shit your gusset.

What do you, yourself, on your own, without a cut 'n' paste actually think?

Originally Posted by King_of_the_Burpas

Sorry. I read your post very carefully and I still can't see a solid opinion about anything. You 'could have been outraged either way' but, presumably weren't. You 'happened' to click on the thread, presumably not through a magnificent, dominant control of your mouse. You mention the 'relevance of some points', arguments that were 'persuasive' but not winning or losing....

You seem to toy with ideas, tickling them like a trout in a stream, but if you thought you'd actually catch one, you'd shit your gusset.

What do you, yourself, on your own, without a cut 'n' paste actually think?

Firstly, you'd be hard pressed to find an instance of me 'cuttin' an' pastin''.

Because I've read very little about the case in question, I remain ambivalent.

I'm unsure if this is definately a paedo ring, or if the perps were targeting 'fragile, damaged girls' and some or all of them happened to be minors and they just didn't care.

I don't actually know whether or not they came from a culture where abuse of minors may have been the norm. I suspect but don't know, that their culture was a contributory factor, but I don't know how to use that information. It's not for me to do anything anyway. MiTs argument that making such a declaration publicly might have a negative effect, I found persuasive and am forced to agree.

I do not believe that victims bear any responsibility for criminal acts against them, regardless of what insurance companies might say.

A good point was made about western treatment of women abroad and thus how all cultures are capable of treating outsiders as somehow of less worth than themselves.

With the crims in this case being Asian and the victims being white, I can understand that people see a racial element, but I don't know if they were targeted because they were white, or because they were young, or because they were vulnerable. I don't know how the crims view women of their own race or other races, other than white. I don't know if vulnerable black girls would have been seen as acceptable victims. Or vulnerable Chinese girls. Or vulnerable Guatemalan girls.

There's really too much I don't know about this and other, what appear to be, similar cases.

So I remain ambivalent.

And if you don't like it, tough shit.

Yes: the the parents are largely free of blame. For the parents weren't looking after the kids.

They were in care, and care homes are already pretty notorious for the poor outcomes of their "graduates" in terms of low qualifications, offending records etc.

Why our publicly funded institutions which are responsible for the care of (difficult, damaged) children hasn't come in for a major kicking here for not being aware of, let alone assessing risks of or preventing children roaming the streets in the middle of the night, astounds me.

Originally Posted by vampangua

Yes: the the parents are largely free of blame. For the parents weren't looking after the kids.

They were in care, and care homes are already pretty notorious for the poor outcomes of their "graduates" in terms of low qualifications, offending records etc.

Why our publicly funded institutions which are responsible for the care of (difficult, damaged) children hasn't come in for a major kicking here for not being aware of, let alone assessing risks of or preventing children roaming the streets in the middle of the night, astounds me.

There was a representative of a care home interviewed and he was saying that they cannot lock these girls in so if they want to go out that's up to them. If this is true they may as well drop the 'care' bit from their title. Even the best brought up children become rebellious as they enter their teens. It's the time when you have to step up your parenting skills, not step away from them.

Originally Posted by Markintime

I don't think that anyone has denied that race, religion and culture have played a part in this affair,
....

I have denied that race is relevant, it isn't. This shit has nothing to do with race, culture yes, race no.

A great pity Winston Smith is no longer blogging & has left Social Care work to return to Ireland. His stories of what goes on are hair-curlingly awful.

Root & branch healing of society needed, but I have absolutely no idea how, in a libertarian and democratic society, we can do this. Answers on a huge sack of postcards please!