ARmy Rumour SErvice

**Markintime** · 12-05-2012, 13:15

Originally Posted by Chef

I listened to Question time last night, the Rochdale trial came up, and the reply seems to have been codified into;

a) I totally condemn these men, their crime was disgusting and should be punished.
b) This sort of crime knows no boundaries of race or religion.
c) The victims were badly let down by the authorities.
d) We should not let the criminal's ethnic/religious background cloud our views on the crimes.

All well and good, the point b) could be quickly substantiated by, as Iron Duke did with one example at the beginning of this thread, giving statistics of the number of rings broken up by police by age, sex (predominately male) and ethnic/religious background. I feel pretty confident that these facts are available. However the absence of these bits of info in the replies makes me wonder if they might undermine the rest of the reply. I honestly don't know. Certainly it seems that the majority of lone pedos are white, males, as one would expect in a country of mainly white make up, but are the 'rings' similarly representative?

The cultural aspect is another side altogether, a workmate of mine was concerned that her son, a black lad, was falling into bad company after leaving primary school, the 'black culture' at secondary school viewed academic achievement with scorn. His mother was worried that he was changing in order to conform. She is a fairly religious married mother, both parents working, with a daughter, younger, and found it hard to keep him within bounds. If it went horribly wrong would the press focus on those facts, or 'another black man goes on the rampage'?

It is interesting that the most outspoken critics have tended to be muslims themselves.

A seperate anecdote to illustrate that; a muslim minicab driver refused to take a couple to a restaurant as they had a bottle of wine. The cab firm apologised and the driver was sacked by acclaim of the other muslim drivers. The owner, a muslim, pointed out that, that was his company's job. No race/religion card was played. Would that have happened if the owner was white?

Oh Supermatelot, remember the pissed girls who gave a drunken kicking to a white girl, they were out late and used their muslim religion as an excuse, as they weren't used to alcohol.

Sooner or later the issue will have to be addressed, the longer its left the harder it will be.

I doubt you will find a breakdown by religion because it is totally irrelevant. If a woman is raped by a white man no-one asks or records his religion, why should that change for those of a duskier hue?

Since there are often headlines in the papers about paedophile rings I'm guessing that there are gangs of every ethnicity preying on the vulnerable. What does often happen though is a knock on effect. Because one gang is broken it gives the victims the courage to talk out. They also tend to be believed more because there is a lot of precedent. Therefore there are more likely to be exposure and convictions. Some of the white 'gangs' (groups) are more firmly established in society. If anyone had suggested that even one Catholic priest was a paedophile even 20 years ago they would have been shouted down and disbelieved. Nowadays people almost expect it of every Catholic priest. The brave victims of this Rochdale gangs are doing so much more than just getting local scum off the streets they're helping every victim and giving them the encouragement to shout out.

There are imbalances in our legal system, there always have been. Posh people tend to get convicted less and receive lighter sentences when they do. How many times has the phrase "I'm a devout Christian" been heard when trying to persuade the authorities that someone is either innocent or that they should be given the benefit of the doubt. In the particular case you mention and in all other cases I don't believe that a person's religion should be taken into account in that way. I wonder if a white Mormon would have been given the same benefit of the doubt?

For the sake of justice and of fairness we should treat all people the same. We should not excuse certain behaviour as being in someone's culture because, if it falls foul of the rules of the land then those are the rules they have agreed to follow, if they came here, and have always been bound by since birth if they were born here. Positive discrimination helps no-one and merely creates divisions and resentment in society the wouldns of which often never heel.

**Boumer** · 12-05-2012, 15:26

Originally Posted by Chef

Oh Supermatelot, remember the pissed girls who gave a drunken kicking to a white girl, they were out late and used their muslim religion as an excuse, as they weren't used to alcohol.

Muslim women not used to drinking walk free after attack on woman - Telegraph

They got particularly light sentences and it wasn't held to be racially aggravated for "reasons" outlined by the CPS down the post.

(However to be blunt, prisons are full and I have seem people get suspended or lesser custodial sentences than perhaps would be expected, which in my uneducated opinion I suspect is due to the realities of prison accomodation available).

I stand to be corrected (I am not a judge) but every law book I have ever read state that self-induced intoxication is not a defence in law (unless one is ignorant of the nature of the drink, ie one asks for a cola and it is "spiked" with alcohol without that persons knowledge). If one takes alchoholic drink, knowing it is alcoholic drink, I do not believe that this is grounds for mitiagation in caselaw? (Well it is now, I guess).

I put it to the court that this was a racially motivated attack (remember, it's a racist attack if someone thinks it is).

Miss Page said Ambaro Maxamed, 24, Ayan Maxamed, 28, and Hibo Maxamed, 24, and their 28-year-old cousin Ifrah Nur screamed "Kill the white slag" while kicking her in the head as she lay motionless on the ground.

Seems quite a fair conclusion to me.

The women all admitted actual bodily harm and received suspended sentences.

The very restrained comment from the victim was;

Miss Page claimed that not jailing the women sent out the wrong message about street violence.

The Attorney General office has no grounds to intervene for unduly lenient

No power to refer "girl gang" sentences as unduly lenient

The CPS helpfully comment as to the lack of racial intent;

The CPS reviewed all the evidence in this case, including whether a racially aggravated offence should be brought on the basis that the comment ‘white bitch’ was reported to have been heard during the incident. However, this racist comment could not be attributed to any particular suspect and was not adopted by the group as a whole. There was therefore no realistic prospect of conviction for a racially aggravated offence

CPS statement on case of Aayan, Hibo and Ambaro Maxamed and Ifran Nur - CPS News Brief

I do not believe it has been possible to attribute the shout of "What What Nigger!" to any member of the gang who attacked and murdered Stephen Lawrence. This did not, quite rightly, prevent the sentencing judge remarking:

"This crime was committed for no other reason than racial hatred"

http://www.judiciary.gov.uk/Resource...ris-120104.pdf

If justice appears to be unbalenced, it will give comfort to the fanatics of both sides. From White racists who will pounce on examples to support their agenda, or Asian racists who scream obscenities at the Judge as they are taken to prison for their crimes.

**WolvoExPunk** · 12-05-2012, 15:48

When these low life scumfucks are eventually let out, I wonder how many people will be waiting to extract their own justice on them. I mean fuck the racists, the decent Muslims will want to sort them out for dragging their good name through the mud.

BTW, I watched SawIII the other night, and it's given me a few ideas. Anyone know where I can get nine mini tape-recorders?

**House Sparrow** · 12-05-2012, 19:51

Originally Posted by TheIronDuke

...with the far more robust statements I read from the Pakistani community leaders - outright condemnation and revulsion. No playing of knee-jerk cards there.

Isn't that the point though? as long as they have their own community leaders.

**jarrod248** · 12-05-2012, 19:56

Originally Posted by WolvoExPunk

When these low life scumfucks are eventually let out, I wonder how many people will be waiting to extract their own justice on them. I mean fuck the racists, the decent Muslims will want to sort them out for dragging their good name through the mud.

BTW, I watched SawIII the other night, and it's given me a few ideas. Anyone know where I can get nine mini tape-recorders?

Things will probably happen to them in prison.

**gunfighter** · 12-05-2012, 20:00

Originally Posted by TheIronDuke

These charmers were from Edinburgh. Dont recall anybody blaming the entire Jock culture and nation?

A paedophile gang that carried out a series of attacks on children and infants, including a three-month-old baby, were found guilty yesterday at the High Court in Edinburgh in a groundbreaking legal case.

The abusers, including a respected youth leader — who had met Tony Blair and the Queen — a civil servant, a bank clerk and a Church of Scotland elder, were part of the largest paedophile network to have been dismantled in Scotland.

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Yes but vile as they are they weren't targetting a specific race because they believed them to be worthless. These were racially motivated sexual attacks however the politicos and PC fuckwits try to deny it !! If the boot were on the other foot the same people would be falling over themselves to condemn them as such. Time to stop pussy footing around and talk straight !

**gunfighter** · 12-05-2012, 20:02

Originally Posted by jarrod248

Things will probably happen to them in prison.

Which will no doubt result in claims of racism inherent in the system and the obligatory compensation payments !!

**jarrod248** · 12-05-2012, 20:04

Originally Posted by gunfighter

Which will no doubt result in claims of racism inherent in the system and the obligatory compensation payments !!

Well a lot of prisoners put complaints in and we settle out of court it's cheaper.

**jimmys_best_mate** · 12-05-2012, 20:26

Originally Posted by gunfighter

Yes but vile as they are they weren't targetting a specific race because they believed them to be worthless.

You're right, they were good peados who respected their victims.

**supermatelot** · 12-05-2012, 20:37

It's going to "kick off" again up north.

I hate to say it but - I'm not very bothered if it does or not. I just hope none of my family get caught up in it if / when it does.

Everybody knows whats been going on but been too afraid of acting on it. Now everybody knows 'it's known'.

This will be an ongoing story of careful wording by the BBC, wheeling out of "community leaders" and the usual apologists. The police will be "Forced" to investigate further. They won't fucking want to either because Aftab's uncle is a councillor at ....council and his cousin is married to a businessman who greases the palms of a senior policeman...