ARmy Rumour SErvice

**twony** · 14-04-2012, 11:53

Originally Posted by Rayc

Things are hotting up in the Pacific rim.

US is to have a base in Darwin.

And recently there was a standoff with the Philippines and China.

Apart from the problems of Vietnam and China.

One wonders what is the endgame.

Did you actually read the article? Particularly the last sentence?

Originally Posted by sunnoficarus

“All options are being considered other than nuclear propulsion which the government has ruled out.”

There's more to this story than the basic facts described ( facts which you seemed to have ignored/ misunderstood) but it's got f all to do with China, Vietnam or the Philippines

Pathetic article, from a publication (Australian Financial Review) which shouldn't have any interest in Defence matters anyway.

Totally ignores the two most obvious issues, described well below.

Originally Posted by AndyPipkin

Running a fleet of SSN's requires more than just a few jetties. There are facilities and associated costs related to managing and disposing of nuclear reactors which go far beyond those required for SSK's. Almost certainly a non-started for Oz unless they fully bought into the USN support system. .

Originally Posted by Petardier

Ha, there's no support for SSNs in Australia, the politics are totally against it. There is also no nuclear industry or other infrastucture apart from a small reactor used to produce medical isotopes. Then there's the question of where to base them, Fleet Base East = Sydney! SSNs in Sydney Harbour, a guarantee for the party supporting it to lose most NSW seats in Federal parliament, megabrave decision minister. Great joke only a mentally retarded spam in Washington totally out of touch with Aust political reality could have dreamt that one up.

Anything involving the word nuclear, is "on the agenda" of the Australian press, due to the current attitude and actions of Australian political parties, in regards to, domestic issues. Not sure if that sentence makes sense, but i can' t be fucked expanding on it, or discussing Australian domestic politics further. But, I will say this story is bullshit, is (possibly deliberately) designed to be misinterperated by non Australians not familiar with the Australian domestic politics.

Originally Posted by sunnoficarus

I think you'll find they will want an off the shelf turnkey solution this time.

As far as I'm aware, at the present time, the plan is that Australia's new submarines will be designed and constructed in Australia.

**sunnoficarus** · 14-04-2012, 12:09

Originally Posted by twony

As far as I'm aware, at the present time, the plan is that Australia's new submarines will be designed and constructed in Australia.

'Designed and built in Australia' does not in any way preclude Australia basing the Collins replacements on a proven and low risk turnkey design from someone like Navantia who have very close ties with Electric Boat. Astute Class SSN's are 'designed and built in Britain', but have extensive EB design input.

**Yeoman_dai** · 14-04-2012, 12:26

Just buy the Germans Dolphin Class. Great little boats.

**Dashing_Chap** · 14-04-2012, 12:33

Originally Posted by Pyianno

Why don't they just buy one off us?

Ask Canada.

**littlejim** · 14-04-2012, 12:53

Originally Posted by sunnoficarus

Apart from any other issues, the journals and their talk of the RAN going nuclear forget one very crucial thing..... Manpower.

The RAN has barely enough people to keep 2~3 Collins boats operational, and they have small crews of 58 that don't need kettle watchers. A Virginia Class SSN has a crew of 135.

We'd better send out the press gangs then because we've got two 27,000 tonne carrier/assault ships being built in Spain. Somebody is going to have to swab the decks and move the Harrier around.

**jimmys_best_mate** · 14-04-2012, 13:25

Originally Posted by Dashing_Chap

Ask Canada.

Wasn't that Canada's fault for dicking round while they slowly rotted in Portsmouth then trying to get them to work with US weapons and UK firecontrol systems to save the expense of buying UK weapons?

**Honky Tonk Donk** · 14-04-2012, 18:36

Originally Posted by sunnoficarus

Apart from any other issues, the journals and their talk of the RAN going nuclear forget one very crucial thing..... Manpower.

The RAN has barely enough people to keep 2~3 Collins boats operational, and they have small crews of 58 that don't need kettle watchers. A Virginia Class SSN has a crew of 135.

They could start by poaching RN talent. I'm sure the RAN could quite easily knock together an attractive package that would have the required number of RN blokes heading Down Under to crew Oz Boats.

**sunnoficarus** · 14-04-2012, 18:59

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk Donk

They could start by poaching RN talent. I'm sure the RAN could quite easily knock together an attractive package that would have the required number of RN blokes heading Down Under to crew Oz Boats.

It's not as if the R N is overmanned with submariners.

**wakatoa** · 14-04-2012, 20:32

Probably no chance of Skippy ever getting SSN's, this is probably part of a softening up process that will lead to Elmer having a couple based out of Darwin, Indonesia is having more subs built as we speak as are other SEA nations. I am sure Ivan is helping the Indos in the background with subs as they are with the Sukhoi's, this will make them a credible threat as long as the sub Ivans stay off the bathtub grog that killed some of the Sukhoi Ivans.
I think Elmer has become rather cross with Skippy and the Collins problems and its gone a little beyond "do try to keep up old chap". There are three situations I can think of right now in SEA that could go off - Phil v China, Indo v Malaysia, Indo internal West Papua where Elmer has the largest copper and gold mine in the world.

**baboon6** · 14-04-2012, 20:53

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk Donk

They could start by poaching RN talent. I'm sure the RAN could quite easily knock together an attractive package that would have the required number of RN blokes heading Down Under to crew Oz Boats.

Aren't they already doing that to an extent?