Useful

**cpunk** · 30-08-2009, 13:10

Originally Posted by Werewolf

Frankly, I have real problems believing anything this woman says.

Spillage in aisle 10.

**duffdike** · 30-08-2009, 13:10

Originally Posted by Stanley1975

Originally Posted by duffdike

Yes but you have clearly adopted the same prejudice while attempting to disguise it.

Read his last post more carefully or have someone spell it out for you

.

I did. I never argue with a woman though. ;)

**Werewolf** · 30-08-2009, 13:14

Originally Posted by cpunk

Originally Posted by Werewolf

Frankly, I have real problems believing anything this woman says.

Spillage in aisle 10.

Such a devastating, logical counter-argument.

I can see why they made you a Mod...

**eodmatt** · 30-08-2009, 13:21

Is there a homeopathic remedy to all this?

**Monty417** · 30-08-2009, 13:25

Originally Posted by duffdike

Originally Posted by cpunk

Originally Posted by Stanley1975

Sorry to say this cpunk, but it's guys like you women should be a bit weary of. You don't need to "defend" us if the drive is being politically correct. The two quotes above may indicate you don't feel comfortable having women as your colleagues.

It probably illustrates my point although I wasn't trying to 'defend' women in the army, merely explain why some men respond in the way they do to cases of this sort. I've been in the army 26 years and seen a lot of changes in that time: it takes a while to get used to and it may well be that, on a subconscious level, I'm uncomfortable with serving alongside women, gays and so on. On the other hand, intellectually I accept that it is wrong to treat people differently because of their gender, sexuality, ethnicity and so forth, and as a consequence I make a conscious effort to alter my behaviour and act against my own prejudices. I don't simply assume that I'm right because that's the way I've always thought and it used to be right twenty-odd years ago.

But actually, the side remark about LBdr Fletcher was because several people who claim to have known her have been quoted in this thread and i have no reason to suppose that the people quoting them are liars.

Yes but you have clearly adopted the same prejudice while attempting to disguise it.

You can't stop predudice, whether homophoebic, racist, whatever. But one can attempt to and succeed in controlling one's own predudices and perhaps come to terms with them. Homosexual people do not bother me and I don't see them as a threat. However, what does get up my nose, are the flaunters, camp men parading around in lycra with limp wrists etc. For fcucks sake, no female that I've ever seen does that. They do a lot of harm to their own kind, mincing about complaining of being put on. Ffs. stop acting like a prat and you won't be treated like like one. The PC Brigade only antagonise people as well, why can't jokes be made about gays? They don't forbid jokes about straights, fat people, priests, nuns, sex, women, chavs, Irish, Scots, etc etc. There have always been same sex preference people, many of them warriors. Ancient Greeks, Spartans, Romans and the Arababic races, etc. Many animals are 'gay' a word that I dislike. Most people today are well over any predudice against same sex, but can't help taking the p*ss, most of us do it at some time or another. Some have good cause to hate them. Those who were sexually molested as kids, by men, will not accept that those men were paedophiles as they only molested male children. To err is human, to forgive, divine. (An Essay on Criticism) Alexander Pope.

**cbgramc** · 30-08-2009, 13:29

Cpunk I don’t think she needs you to fight her corner she did that quite well herself. Please don’t confuse our prejudices with yours, I have nothing against and have served with women all my service never once have I had an issue with any of them. I have also served with Gays of both sex and again never had a single problem as long as the rules were followed.

As I said if this was flagged as a CoC Failure it would not have been worth 10 bob, but say it is to do with her being a lesbian and the sky is her limit, her being a lezzy is a side issue the case was harassment and failures in the system not that she was a lesbian she made that a factor. The other issue is that she mentioned or was drawn into to comparing her settlement with that of injured of killed service people indefensible.

**cpunk** · 30-08-2009, 13:38

Originally Posted by cbgramc

Cpunk I don’t think she needs you to fight her corner she did that quite well herself. Please don’t confuse our prejudices with yours, I have nothing against and have served with women all my service never once have I had an issue with any of them. I have also served with Gays of both sex and again never had a single problem as long as the rules were followed.

As I said if this was flagged as a CoC Failure it would not have been worth 10 bob, but say it is to do with her being a lesbian and the sky is her limit, her being a lezzy is a side issue the case was harassment and failures in the system not that she was a lesbian she made that a factor. The other issue is that she mentioned or was drawn into to comparing her settlement with that of injured of killed service people indefensible.

I get the sense from this that you disagree with me, but I'm not sure what you actually mean so I shall hold back from commenting for the time being.

**Monty417** · 30-08-2009, 13:48

Originally Posted by cbgramc

Cpunk I don’t think she needs you to fight her corner she did that quite well herself. Please don’t confuse our prejudices with yours, I have nothing against and have served with women all my service never once have I had an issue with any of them. I have also served with Gays of both sex and again never had a single problem as long as the rules were followed.

As I said if this was flagged as a CoC Failure it would not have been worth 10 bob, but say it is to do with her being a lesbian and the sky is her limit, her being a lezzy is a side issue the case was harassment and failures in the system not that she was a lesbian she made that a factor. The other issue is that she mentioned or was drawn into to comparing her settlement with that of injured of killed service people indefensible.

Amost in complete agreement. But, the prat of an SNCO in question brought the lesbian issue into it, by making unwanted sexual advances and lewd texts claiming that he could turn her 'straight'. This was the hard core of her case for discrimination, and discrimination against her sexual orientation. Quite frankly, she'd won before it started. Just a matter of how much.

**commzmeanzbombz** · 30-08-2009, 14:05

Have any of you out there abusing said SNCO of various crimes etc actually read the results of the case and what he was or was not found guilty of?

I reckon if he had the urge he could come out of his happy retirement and probably build up a case of slander himself!

Just to clarify my point, she was awarded compensation because of her treatment by the MOD, not that of the SNCO in question, he was found guilty of nothing and no disciplinary action was taken.

**cbgramc** · 30-08-2009, 14:13

Sorry cpunk I was obviously not very eloquent in my post, I get where you are coming from but I think we are now in a situation where we spring to the defence of “minorities” just to do so. I think this Woman had a strong case for harassment and should have been compensated. But look around at other tribunals and see what harassment cases get 10k if lucky. If this was a female Soldier who was harassed for being Scottish, having red hair or walking with a squint she would not have got anything like that amount of money.

We should always protect the weak and defend those who are unable to defend themselves but I think she fell into neither of these two categories.