Thread: BNP Win Their First EU Seat

Originally Posted by Markintime

OK Stacker does this make sense to you?

Because it certainly doesn't make sense to me.

1. I vote for Sinn Fein, their manifesto says their aim is a united Ireland under Irish Republican Rule; therefore I am a Republican.

2. I vote for the Ulster Democratic Party whose manifesto says they are dedicated to keeping NI as part of the UK and seperate from RoI; therefore I am a Unionist.

3. I vote for the British National Party whose election manifesto says they aim to remove all non-white, non-indigenous people from the UK; therefore I am not a racist.

If people are going to support BNP then why the hell can't they admit that they are racist? They believe in it enough to vote for them, why not be proud of that unless they know that what they're doing is morally wrong?

Is everyone who votes labour a socialist? or perhaps in 1997 their voters were a cross section of society who thought labour would do the best for them (HAH).
As the BNP vote seem to grow every year are people suddenly turning into racists?
You don't have to be racist to agree with some of the BNP policies. I've never seen ALL_I_WANT post anything racist yet he still voted for them.
If the BNP have policies that are appealing to the voters then perhaps the main parties might want to take note instead of just saying racist all the time.

Originally Posted by stacker1

Is everyone who votes labour a socialist? or perhaps in 1997 their voters were a cross section of society who thought labour would do the best for them (HAH).
As the BNP vote seem to grow every year are people suddenly turning into racists?
You don't have to be racist to agree with some of the BNP policies. I've never seen ALL_I_WANT post anything racist yet he still voted for them.
If the BNP have policies that are appealing to the voters then perhaps the main parties might want to take note instead of just saying racist all the time.

Back in '97 if the main manifesto pledge of the Labour Party was to invade Iraq would you have voted for them? In fact if any party had pledged that would you have voted for them?
You cannot ignore the main stated aim of a party when voting for them. If you don't want a united Ireland then you don't vote SF if you don't want to remain part of the UK you don't vote UDP, simple really.

Originally Posted by Markintime

Back in '97 if the main manifesto pledge of the Labour Party was to invade Iraq would you have voted for them? In fact if any party had pledged that would you have voted for them?
You cannot ignore the main stated aim of a party when voting for them. If you don't want a united Ireland then you don't vote SF if you don't want to remain part of the UK you don't vote UDP, simple really.

The BNP want a united Ireland and I believe they are closer to the unionists than the republicans.
The BNP have a lots of stated aims, I suggest people care more about the ones that will affect them for the better rather than other people for the worse. A British builder might not care about getting issued an assault rifle but he might care that a pole has just undercut his quote and took his work of him.

Originally Posted by stacker1

Originally Posted by Markintime

Back in '97 if the main manifesto pledge of the Labour Party was to invade Iraq would you have voted for them? In fact if any party had pledged that would you have voted for them?
You cannot ignore the main stated aim of a party when voting for them. If you don't want a united Ireland then you don't vote SF if you don't want to remain part of the UK you don't vote UDP, simple really.

The BNP want a united Ireland and I believe they are closer to the unionists than the republicans.
The BNP have a lots of stated aims, I suggest people care more about the ones that will affect them for the better rather than other people for the worse. A British builder might not care about getting issued an assault rifle but he might care that a pole has just undercut his quote and took his work of him.

So what you're saying is that back in 1933 a German who voted for the NSDAP because they had a policy of getting the trains to run on side was completely innocent of the death of 6 million souls.
I'm also amused by the way that you set yourself up to speak for everyone that voted BNP and none of them are racist. Well, whether you like it or not you voted in a racist party with stated racist aims who, if they got into power would get rid of everyone who wasn't 100% white British (compulsory DNA testing?). That, my friend makes you and everyone else who voted BNP racist, by definition.

Originally Posted by Markintime

So what you're saying is that back in 1933 a German who voted for the NSDAP because they had a policy of getting the trains to run on side was completely innocent of the death of 6 million souls.
I'm also amused by the way that you set yourself up to speak for everyone that voted BNP and none of them are racist. Well, whether you like it or not you voted in a racist party with stated racist aims who, if they got into power would get rid of everyone who wasn't 100% white British (compulsory DNA testing?). That, my friend makes you and everyone else who voted BNP racist, by definition.

I didn't say a few posts ago that some members were out and out racists then? Or are you just choosing the bits you like as usual?
They won't get into power althoug they will get stronger for the foreseable future. I'm sure once the three main partys start losing more seat they will start "borrowing" form the BNP you know like "British jobs for British people"

Just to jump back to what you said earlier

Originally Posted by Markintime

Back in '97 if the main manifesto pledge of the Labour Party was to invade Iraq would you have voted for them? In fact if any party had pledged that would you have voted for them?

I seem to remember a general election 2 years after the invasion of Iraq in which 35% of the voters opted for Labour. Were all labour voters really lackeys of the Americans?

Originally Posted by AFA06

I do understand that some of the BNP are further right wing in their thoughts but on the whole they are closer to mine than the other parties are, which is why I like a lot of their policies.

Which ones incidentally?

Other than the whole racist thing, which we'll have to agree to disagree about, the BNPs policies are basically old fashioned, unreconstructed Labour. Isolationism, re-nationalisation and economic illiteracy are all given pride of place in their last manifesto. Good left wing traditional values.

In addition to that there's the abject stupidity of their defence policy, which seems to amount to withdrawing the army from everywhere and have them ringing the nation's coastline on the lookout for all those sneaky asylum seekers, with the added fun of national service and an assault rifle under the bed of every dole-monkey in the country. I'll take my chances with the caliphate, thank you very much.

As far as I'm concerned BNP=Old Labour+racism+supidity, but I'm genuinely interested as to which of their policies appeals to you.

Originally Posted by stacker1

Originally Posted by Markintime

So what you're saying is that back in 1933 a German who voted for the NSDAP because they had a policy of getting the trains to run on side was completely innocent of the death of 6 million souls.
I'm also amused by the way that you set yourself up to speak for everyone that voted BNP and none of them are racist. Well, whether you like it or not you voted in a racist party with stated racist aims who, if they got into power would get rid of everyone who wasn't 100% white British (compulsory DNA testing?). That, my friend makes you and everyone else who voted BNP racist, by definition.

I didn't say a few posts ago that some members were out and out racists then? Or are you just choosing the bits you like as usual?
They won't get into power althoug they will get stronger for the foreseable future. I'm sure once the three main partys start losing more seat they will start "borrowing" form the BNP you know like "British jobs for British people"

Just to jump back to what you said earlier

Originally Posted by Markintime

Back in '97 if the main manifesto pledge of the Labour Party was to invade Iraq would you have voted for them? In fact if any party had pledged that would you have voted for them?

I seem to remember a general election 2 years after the invasion of Iraq in which 35% of the voters opted for Labour. Were all labour voters really lackeys of the Americans? No and they didn't vote to invade Iraq because that had already happened. Keep going off at a tangent why don't you, you're not as good as Sven/Whet but you're getting there.

Originally Posted by Markintime

No and they didn't vote to invade Iraq because that had already happened. Keep going off at a tangent why don't you, you're not as good as Sven/Whet but you're getting there.

Its not me who makes up stuff, like me saying none of the BNP voters were racist for instance.
Back to Labour for a bit, So why did a third of the voting public decide that despite invading another country because the yanks thought it was a good idea, causing the deaths of British soldiers and Iraqis, that Labour should have another term in office was it perhaps they didn't care about either squaddies or the Iraqis, maybe they thought labour would help them though. Just the same as some people who vote BNP aren't racist but don't really care if all ayslum seekers are deported, they want the BNP to secure their jobs.

Originally Posted by Tom_of_Bedlam

As far as I'm concerned BNP=Old Labour+racism+supidity, but I'm genuinely interested as to which of their policies appeals to you.

I rather like this policy:

"We support the re-introduction of corporal punishment for petty criminals and vandals, and the restoration of capital punishment for paedophiles, terrorists and murderers as an option for judges in cases where their guilt is proven beyond dispute, as by DNA evidence or being caught red-handed."

No. Let's not deviate over to Labour. This thread is about the BNP.

They are Fascist, Racist, Thugs.

If you voted for them wear the cap - I'm sure that it fits.

Their policies are based entirely around the erroneous notion of "racial superiority" (ignoring for the monent that there is only one race - the human one), their economic proposals are woeful, and their defence policies worse. The only reason why they should be allowed a platform for their views is to allow the rest of us to laugh and point.

Originally Posted by Mr_Fingerz

The only reason why they should be allowed a platform for their views is to allow the rest of us to laugh and point.

..and thats just about what happens when they do get a chance to air their views, which is why they should get the chance, let them shoot themselves in the foot. Instead for the last 10 years all that has happened is the mob shout racist, deny them a platform and pretend that that will stop the BNP, it hasn't and wont.

Originally Posted by Mr_Fingerz

No. Let's not deviate over to Labour. This thread is about the BNP.

They are Fascist, Racist, Thugs.

If you voted for them wear the cap - I'm sure that it fits.

Their policies are based entirely around the erroneous notion of "racial superiority" (ignoring for the monent that there is only one race - the human one), their economic proposals are woeful, and their defence policies worse. The only reason why they should be allowed a platform for their views is to allow the rest of us to laugh and point.

I won't argue that the BNP as a potential party in power is laughable - I believe that I said in my first post that they could never seriously run a country.

What I said, or tried to say was that the BNP manifesto is the only one out of all the parties that sees Britain as a nation - they are nationalistic and this is what appeals to so many people.

Maybe you are not sick of the other parties and their diluted policies both external and internal that appear to be centred on destroying all that is British but I am.

As I have said all along, I am not racist nor do I agree with racist polcies but I do support their nationalism and I would support any party that had Britain at the heart of its manifesto. Not all supporters of the BNP are racist, whether you believe that or not. I for one am not one, nor am I a BNP plant on this site. I just have a difference of opinion.

Originally Posted by AFA06

What I said, or tried to say was that the BNP manifesto is the only one out of all the parties that sees Britain as a nation - they are nationalistic and this is what appeals to so many people.

I disagree with this entirely. As far as I'm concerned the Britain I feel proud to be a part of, the epitome of British values, is as much that of Beharry VC as Bromhead VC. The BNP seek to deny the worth of swathes of our society, and of our army, and this should be resisted at all costs.

Originally Posted by Tom_of_Bedlam

Originally Posted by AFA06

What I said, or tried to say was that the BNP manifesto is the only one out of all the parties that sees Britain as a nation - they are nationalistic and this is what appeals to so many people.

I disagree with this entirely. As far as I'm concerned the Britain I feel proud to be a part of, the epitome of British values, is as much that of Beharry VC as Bromhead VC. The BNP seek to deny the worth of swathes of our society, and of our army, and this should be resisted at all costs.

My Bold

The BNP should be resisted but simply shouting racist doesn't work.

Originally Posted by Bukit_Basha

Originally Posted by Tom_of_Bedlam

Originally Posted by AFA06

What I said, or tried to say was that the BNP manifesto is the only one out of all the parties that sees Britain as a nation - they are nationalistic and this is what appeals to so many people.

I disagree with this entirely. As far as I'm concerned the Britain I feel proud to be a part of, the epitome of British values, is as much that of Beharry VC as Bromhead VC. The BNP seek to deny the worth of swathes of our society, and of our army, and this should be resisted at all costs.

My Bold

The BNP should be resisted but simply shouting racist doesn't work.

My argument is that people who may be thinking of voting for the BNP need to know that they will be supporting racist policies which are at the very core of BNP thinking. The first thing the BNP government would do is carry out the racist policies, long before they looked at any non-racist nationalist policies. To vote for the BNP is to vote for racism which makes them racist.
Then we need to look at why they have become racist, is it because they believe BNP propaganda that a brown skin is the root of all evil and the cause of every problem this country faces? It's classic Hitler; unite a country that feels it is losing it's prominence in the world by creating a focus for all their hatred and feelings of national inadequacy. Eliminate the focus and all your problems will be lifted, reaction to a perceived threat is far more unifying than ideology, it allows people to con themselves that they aren't racist, it's for the common good.
I don't believe that people vote for the BNP because of their nationalisation policy. Those that desperately want re-nationalisation are all Labour supporters who fervently believe that Labour will go back to it's original policies after a period in the wilderness. I know this because I live in Hull where John Prescott is still regarded as a deity and because all I hear these days is 'wait til we get back to our core values'. People don't vote for a minor aspect of a party like BNP if they basically accept that we are all equal and all entitled to a place in our society unless we carry out actions that place us outside of that society. They have to accept that they will be voting in racist policies whatever else appeals to them about the BNP.