Originally Posted by Werewolf

While there is no doubt the CIA etc supplied the Mujahadeen with both money and weapons, to label the Taliban as the "creations" of the Americans is to oversimplfy the situation.

IIRC, the Saudi's also sent vast amounts of money to the Mujhadeen; in excess of $1 Billion, I believe.

Are you suggesting that the CIA is a state withing a state? In which case isn't it time the US spread some democracy within its own borders?

But that's not the point, the, what looks like inevitable, war between two nuclear powers + China seems to have "made in USA" print on it yet again! Let's not delude ourselves, it has nothing to do with the "war on terror" (since the US keeps creating the very same terrorists it later claims to fight) and everything to do with the US failing economic and political standing. What is the best way to improve the situation if not to let competitors fight each other? Is UK going to get involved too?

Originally Posted by Domovoy

Originally Posted by Werewolf

While there is no doubt the CIA etc supplied the Mujahadeen with both money and weapons, to label the Taliban as the "creations" of the Americans is to oversimplfy the situation.

IIRC, the Saudi's also sent vast amounts of money to the Mujhadeen; in excess of $1 Billion, I believe.

Are you suggesting that the CIA is a state withing a state? In which case isn't it time the US spread some democracy within its own borders?

But that's not the point, the, what looks like inevitable, war between two nuclear powers + China seems to have "made in USA" print on it yet again! Let's not delude ourselves, it has nothing to do with the "war on terror" (since the US keeps creating the very same terrorists it later claims to fight) and everything to do with the US failing economic and political standing. What is the best way to improve the situation if not to let competitors fight each other? Is UK going to get involved too?

No, I was agreeing that American agencies, in this case the CIA, helped to fund and arm the proto-Taliban. I was simply pointing out that they were not the only players in the Game.

I disagree that war between Pakistan and India is inevitable. While there are hard-liners/psychos/idiots on both sides, there also pragmatists who don't want to get a case of Terminal Sunburn.

And I don't think a Pakistan - Indian war is in the best intrests of the Americans or anyone else...except the Taliban.

I don't think a nuclear exchange is in the interests of anybody within hundreds of miles of anywhere one lands.

A conventional strike is well within possibility. The Indian population want a tangible retaliation for Bombay.

Conventional strikes don't mean a Nuclear response, China and Russia hammered each other silly in the 80's and neither went Nuclear.

However, there is a danger to my mind.

The Pakistani Government is toppled by Islamist hard-liners when the Pakistani performance is less than stellar in the face of Indian action and that creates dramas for all of us.

Other outrageous scenarios ..

India airlifts 2 Brigades to Afghanistan to close the door.

China gets involved.

Given the |Pak Army's miserable showing in their 'Tribal Trust' areas,I don't think that the Indians will have much of a problem with them.Then there is the small matter of numbers of men.

Originally Posted by Werewolf

I disagree that war between Pakistan and India is inevitable. While there are hard-liners/psychos/idiots on both sides, there also pragmatists who don't want to get a case of Terminal Sunburn.

I hope you are right…

Originally Posted by Werewolf

And I don't think a Pakistan - Indian war is in the best intrests of the Americans or anyone else...except the Taliban.

Someone has to have a motive and the means to start the war. Although I agree that Taliban might benefit from it (ironically!), it doesn’t have a motive or the means to cause it. Who has?

Originally Posted by PartTimePongo

Other outrageous scenarios ..

India airlifts 2 Brigades to Afghanistan to close the door.

China gets involved.

Interesting that .....considering that Abbottabad and Gilgit has seen a sudden influx of Chinese tourism (majority seeming to be youngish men) and the Karkoram Highway (a highway linking China and Northern Pakistan) has seen a large stream of Chinese made vehicles heading towards Pakistan.

Chinese new year in Quetta? :D

What's the Indian IL76 Fleet doing at the moment?

Originally Posted by PartTimePongo

What's the Indian IL76 Fleet doing at the moment?

Practising low visibility flying, I would suspect. Fog in Kashmir and can be awful, especially in winter! :D

This could be good news for the western nations. If india attacks pakistan then britain and america are off the hook in the most virulent hotbed of terrorist propaganda that has ever been. India , a powerful country doesn't want pakistan next door, the western civilised world doesn't want pakistan, are their Iranian allies going to give them military aid? Pretty doubtful. That country needs a ferocious kick in the teeth, what better instrument to deliver it than It's historical hated neighbour sponsered by the western nations.
TB