ARmy Rumour SErvice

**hitback** · 11-12-2005, 16:34

This has been on the armynet for some time now,there has been no reply from the TOP BRASS. The Discrimination and disdain shown to serving and ex-forces personnel is just as disgracefull as before. I have covered this topic in detail on the armynet,with letters fom MP's MEP's and even the PM. All of them sympathise with the plight of military families and their need for housing in civilian street. This topic has been sent back to the Deputy Prime Ministers Office and the Ministry Of Defence to review or not review the Homelessness Legislation.
I will be placing all of the letters from the armynet on here over the next couple of weeks. I would ask everone that reads this site to understand, those that serve this country deserve better treatment from the Governments of the day.

In the Armed Forces we dont have to deal with social housing during our terms of service. From my own experience, with sixteen months left to serve, I have found that acquiring social housing is not an automatic right upon leaving the forces and infact service personnel are less likely to obtain social housing than any other group within the UK. The reasons I have found for this are as follows:

Under legislation at present it states: 15.10 Under s.199(2) and (3), serving members of the armed forces, and other persons who normally live with them as part of their household, do not establish a local connection with a district by virtue of serving, or having served, there while in the forces.

I would like to say this about local connection points, if you do not have a local connection to the area that you are asking to live in, then you have no chance at all. However a civilian only has to live in an area for six months to get a local connection??. (ARMED FORCES PERSONNEL DONT HAVE THIS RIGHT).
10% of social housing in the UK has been left to one side for immigration. There is one million less social houses in the UK now than there was twenty years ago, and over one hundred thousand people deamed homeless in the UK. This is why local connection is so important if you are looking to be housed.

I am aware that some Military personnel will be asking why not buy your own house??.
At this moment in time I have a chronic medical injury and don't know if I will be able to work again, so a mortgage is very hard to obtain at present.

That to one side, we pay taxes for over twenty two years, go where our government send us without question and in return when you look into it we aren't entitled in any way, not even the dole (if required), if you have that pension.

I would just like to finish with stating that I have spoken to my local MP, Royal British Legion, JSHAO, Local Council and Housing Association in my area. I am permitted to go on the register but with only thirty three points , I have no chance of being housed.

I have covered this area in greater detail in (FAMILY ISSUES), (Poll) Social / Housing Association. When you read the other site you will see that I have been directed all over the place but forward.
Could you please answer the following question: I would like to know if the higher Chain of Command would be able to address this issue with the next / current Minister For Defence or even better the PM.

**hitback** · 11-12-2005, 16:37

I have pasted all the other site onto this one so you can see for your self how bad we are treated by local councils.??

Hello all.

Thank you to those who have placed their vote, anyone who thinks that this will not affect them in the future is so very wrong.

This is a letter I received from the Housing Aid and Advice Centre, these people deal with a large range of housing issues in Bedfordshire and each county will have it's own. I did ask them about who they help with housing and their area covers: those who are homeless or about to become homeless, Those on the streets and those who are here legally as well as those not here legally, their range of subjects are to long to list . However you will see by this letter we don't come into any of those categories.

22/11/04

Dear Nick,
Please accept my apologies for not getting back to you as soon as promised, but I have been discussing your problem with several of my more knowledgeable colleagues, as what A++++++ Housing Association is telling you seems to be correct and I wanted to see if I could find any kind of loophole that we could take advantage of. There does not seem to be one. Whilst I appreciate and agree with your argument for local connection, legislation states that as you were placed there by the Armed Forces and not through choice, local connection cannot apply.

I wish that there was more I could do to help your situation, but unforunately there isn't. I hope that your M.P. can be of more help. Good luck and best wishes.

Your Sincerely

+++++++++++

I think the issue that we are sent to an area with our families to serve this country should not be held against us. From my own situation. this will be my last posting, I have currently served over four years here and my two eldest children (aged 17 and 13) have both established roots within their school life and social life. Please ensure you go onto the POLL site and register your VOTE.

Thank you

Nick

PS there will be more installments to follow: M.P letters, Under Secretary of State for Defence and Minister for Veterans Affairs.

**hitback** · 11-12-2005, 16:44

This is a letter I received back from my local MP. This letter was the start of my campaign to get the current homlessness legislation changed. I, like many other people, have or are, serving this country in hostile countries all over the world. When we come home to settle down with our familiy,we are told you have no right to live in this area of the country,you have no local connection points.

Dear Mr Cxxxxx.

Thank you for your letter of 1s November 2004.

I have taken up your points with Mr XXXXXXX, Chief Executive of XXXXXX Housing Association. When I have some further information I will contact you again, but in the meantime if I can do anything else to help please do not hesitate to get in touch.

With all good wishes.

Yours sincerely

XXXXXXXXXX

**hitback** · 11-12-2005, 16:49

This is the letter I recieved back from the Housing Association via my local MP.

Dear Mr Sxxxxxx MP

Reference: MR N Cxxxxxx,

Thank you for your letter received 15 November 2004 regarding Mr Cxxxxx's application for assistance with housing.
Having checked Mr Cxxxxxx's application file, I can confirm a total of 33 points have been awarded as follows:

Bedroom deficiency 10
Medical 18
Dependant children 5
Total 33

Local connection points are awarded in line with Section 199 of the Housing Act 1996 Part VII, as amended by the Homelessness Act 2002. To be eligible for these points an applicant must meet one or more of the following criteria:

I. He or she is, or was in the past, normally resident there, and that the residence was of his or her own choice; or

II. He or she is employed there (i.e. the applicant actually works there; it would not be sufficient that his or her employer's head office was
located there); or

III. Family associations there; or

IV. Any special circumstances (e.g. the need to be near special medical or support services which are only available in a particular district)

However, there are specific exemptions to the above, which include:

Ex-service personnel (Code of Guidance, Homelessness Act 2002)
Under Section 199(2) and (3), serving members of the armed forces, and other persons who normally live with them as part of their household, do not establish a local connection with the district by virtue of serving, or having served, there while in the forces.
Having re-assessed Mr Cxxxxx's application and checked the information provided, I can confirm that as a serving member of the armed forces with no other connection to this district, his application does not attract local connection points at this time.

I hope this information is useful to you and explains the reasons
Mr Cxxxx does not qualify for this particular category of points. However, should you require any further information, please do not hesitate to contact me or Hxxxxx Bxxxxx Housing Needs Manager, who will also be happy to assist you.

Yours sincerely

Axxxx Hxxx
Chief Executive

As you can see in this letter sent by the Housing Association for this area. As members of the Armed Forces we are not entitled to local connection unless we have family in the area. Criteria 2 doesn't count for us but if we were civilians with a part/full time job it would. I believe however the Governments word for this legislation it comes back to one meaning, (DISCRIMINATION).

**hitback** · 11-12-2005, 16:56

This is the letter I got back from my local MP, as you will see by this letter he was not impressed with the reply from the Housing Association. As you can see by the date, this was over a year ago and I'm still trying to get housing rights for military personnel and their families.

1st December 2004

Dear Mr Cxxxxx

Following my inquiries on your behalf, I have now received a reply from xxxxx xxxxxxx, Chief Executive of the xxxxxx Housing Association. I am enclosing a copy for your information.

I am sorry that this is not a more encouraging response. However, as you discussed with my office, I have taken up your points with Rt Hon Geoff Hoon MP, Secretary of State for Defence. When I have some further information I will contact you again, but in the meantime if I can do anything else to help please do not hesitate to get in touch.
With all good wishes.

Yours sincerely

xxxxxx Sxxxx MP

Enc.

The Rt Hon Geoff Hoon MP, Passed my details onto the under secretary of state for defence and minister for veterans. I will be showing his reply letter and others in the next couple of weeks.

**Percy_Pigeon** · 11-12-2005, 16:57

Stay in your quarters I have seen this work wonders.
I have seen this work for all ranks. I believe once this happens many doors open (my only experience is with divorces, hence reply).

Until you are a problem no one wants to know, you have to make your self a problem.

I agree it shouldn’t be this way, but it is

**hitback** · 11-12-2005, 17:07

This is the reply I got back from my local MP, What you must understand from his reply is the following: This was my first port of call, on this very long journey around Social Housing for the Armed Forces. (JSHAO).

Member of Parliament

4th January 2005

Dear Mr Cxxxxx
Following my inquiries on your behalf, I have now received a reply from xxxxxx xxxx MP, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State for Defence, regarding your housing problems.

I enclose a copy of this correspondence for your records.
I believe that the solution Mr xxxxxx outlines will prove the appropriate route of redress for you. The Joint Service Housing Advice Office is able to offer specialist advice and can help you interpret Government housing legislation.

If you have any further questions or require further assistance in dealing with your housing problems, please do not hesitate to contact me.
With all good wishes

Yours Sincerely
Xxxxx xxxx MP

When ever I get a reply on the ARRSE site, I will paste another letter into this site. This should keep the interest level up as well as pushing the issue out into the big bad world.

**hitback** · 11-12-2005, 17:13

This is the reply that my local MP is talking about. I will say it makes complete sense to go through JSHAO as they do have alot of helpfull information, but I already know this I have spoken to the person in charge of the establishment. He was very understanding to my personal plight.
As long as this legislation stays the way it is all members of the Armed Forces "No Matter What The Rank" could find themselves in need of social housing. All that I can understand about this country is you can serve it, But legislation will stop you being housed by it.

PARLIAMENTARY UNDER-SECRETARY OF STATE FOR DEFENCE AND MINISTER FOR VETERANS

20 December 2004
XXXXX XXXXXX Esq MP
House of Commons London
SW1AOAA

Dear XXXXXXXX

Thank you for your letter of 1 December to Geoff Hoon enclosing one from your constituent, Mr Cxxxxx of xx xxxxxx xxxxxx, xxxxxxxx, xxxxxxxxxxxx, regarding his housing problems. I am replying as this matter falls within my area of responsibility.

In the first instance Mr Cxxxxx should be advised to contact the Joint Service Housing Advice Office (JSHAO). The office, based in Salisbury, is there specifically to help Service leavers find appropriate civilian housing as they leave the Service. The JSHAO will ask him to complete a basic questionnaire, which will help establish his needs and enable them to give him some practical advice. The JSHAO has access to a number of housing solutions, which may be appropriate to Mr Cxxxxxx's needs although they are inevitably constrained by availability.
The JSHAO will also help Mr Cxxxxx deal with Government housing legislation.

The Joint Service Housing Advice Office can be contacted at the address
below:
Joint service Housing Advice Office
HQ xxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxx
Exxxxxxxx Barracks
xxxxxxxx
Salisbury
xxxxxxxxxx
Tel: xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxx
E mail: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

I hope this information will provide the guidance that Mr Cxxxxx requires and wish him the very best for his return to civilian life.

Yours
xxxxxxxxxx

I will be keeping this topic upto date over the next couple of weeks. If you have tried to get housing in the social sector please let all the other people that read this site know how you got on.

AFF and RBL are looking into the points that I have covered so fare. I understand that this issue is being taken up with those in command positions and hopefully someone out there will change this DISCRIMINATIONAL legislation against the Armed Forces in relation to local connection.

Thank you Nick

**hitback** · 11-12-2005, 18:22

This is a copy of the letter sent to Adam Ingram MP. I have had a reply to this letter already,or I should say my MP has. The reply was short. It stated that the "MOD was processing my case". I dont mean to sound cynical, but that sounds like "bite the bullet" "or bad luck". Well I will have to wait and see. Any way this is the letter that was sent. I have removed the name of my MP. Also the postal address of Adam Ingram, also my house details

N***** D*****MP
Member of Parliament for ******* *******

Rt. Hon. Adam Ingram
M*** B*****
W*****
London

21 June 2005

Dear

I am writing on behalf of my constituent Mr Nick Cxxxxxx of ** **** *****, ******, *******, *******, ********, who is serving in the army at ******** camp.

Mr Cxxxxxxs service finishes next year and he and his family are likely to become homeless as Bedford does not have MOD housing for ex-servicemen. He has serious spinal damage and may face the prospect of being discharged early on medical grounds. Mr Cxxxxx has written to the MOD and Bedford's accommodation service A**** Housing Association but he has not received any help.

As thirty per cent of the homeless are ex-servicemen Mr Cxxxx faces a very real threat.

Mr Cxxxxxx has provided extensive documentation which I can forward should you consider his case. I look forward to receiving your response to this matter in due course.

N***** D***** MP
Member of Parliament for ***********

**hitback** · 12-12-2005, 12:29

This is information from the local news for Mid Beds 14th 07 05, there is over three thousand people in Cambridge alone on the waiting list for social housing. The point I have been trying to make in this forum is with 30% of Ex-Forces personnel homeless in this country, and with the present Homelessness Act 2002. Jordans Publication 2nd edition. Legislation Local Connection Ex-Service Personnel 15.10 Under s. 199(2) and (3). It's impossible to even get a chance at social housing. There's a real need to put this issue on a level playing field. We shouldn't be punished for serving our country. Therefore, we must try and get the government to capitulate and change current legislation.

I have also read the homelessness Act 2002. Special Bulletin.
Appendix 4, P135, Paragraphs 8.20, 8,24 etc. This paper is just a white wash of responsibility. The government can say we've handed this area over to local councils to make their own decision. When Local councils take into consideration the points that are made in this special bulletin. They will send a letter to the applicant saying we have taken your issues into consideration. This is all they have to do, consider your issues.